Hmmmm not sure about this........

[kneesparks]

Hi all i spent like 5 hours struggling to take off the std williams zorst manifold and putting on the Prowler S/S manifold........... After lots of shouting and cussing i managed to tighten up the 4-2-1 manifold and down pipe only to be disappointed with the results :shock: :cry:
It does not seem to have made sod all difference to the power of the car, apart from maybe loosing a lil mid range grunt. On the std manifold the car picked up again at 5500 RPM now it just feels a lil flat and picks up at 4500 and pulls the same till the red line.......... :roll: is it me going mad?? :?

[arj256]

Have you double checked theres no leaks? As the fire ring can be a pain to get a decent seal on.

And it wouldn't do no harm resetting the ecu by disconnecting the battery for a little while.

[kneesparks]

Put new Renault manifold gasket on and checked everything was sealed

[number1]

When i first fitted my supersprint i was a little disappointed tbh, but a few days went by and the car seemed to pull better, now id say it has made a difference, Certainly didnt loose any power, just gained a nice bit from 5250 onwards :D

[2 live]

tbf. if the 4-2-1 was a better mani for the car, youd think reno would have fitted one as std.

they chose not to. know wot theyre doing these little froggies.

[kneesparks]

tbf. if the 4-2-1 was a better mani for the car, youd think reno would have fitted one as std.

they chose not to. know wot theyre doing these little froggies.
Built to a price, mass production, thats why alot of ppl change stuff about :wink:

[number1]

Ye Valver manifold is cast which is probably uber cheap to mass produce, williams item isnt stainless but probably hand crafted,
Supersprints and the like being made out of stainless are obviously going to be dearer to make, The Supersprint is a work of art in a fabricators eyes, it only cracks because the engine will move around and anything solid will flex,
Anyway back to topic, Anyone who thinks there going to gain 10mph up there favourite bit of road by fitting a supersprint/devil/prowler should think again, its not exactly like you'll pull car lengths on your old set up!
The reason i got mine but only because it was 2 weeks old and Half the price of a new one i bought it, Curiosity had me wondering what the difference would be, i was happy with the results after the car got used to it, but i wouldnt have been happy if i had paid top whack!

[sideways danny]

manifold isn't something that'll do much on it's own. Good complimentary mod for a more tuned engine though. Hated the willy manifold so I've modded a 172 manifold to go on Bex car, need to adjust the PAS pipe so it can fit over the top of the subframe now.

[Coops]

braided lines are ur friend :wink:

[sideways danny]

braided lines are ur friend :wink:

nope, local hydraulics place is though ;) Not a paying job so it's getting done bit by bit for fun :)

[stan]

I cant think of a worse job that working with unterminated braided lines..

Bits if wire in your fingertips/under finger nails is not my idea of fun :lol:

[eternalife]

Hi all i spent like 5 hours struggling to take off the std williams zorst manifold and putting on the Prowler S/S manifold........... After lots of shouting and cussing i managed to tighten up the 4-2-1 manifold and down pipe only to be disappointed with the results :shock: :cry:
It does not seem to have made sod all difference to the power of the car, apart from maybe loosing a lil mid range grunt. On the std manifold the car picked up again at 5500 RPM now it just feels a lil flat and picks up at 4500 and pulls the same till the red line.......... :roll: is it me going mad?? :?

Exhaust design - open can of worms :D
My advice would be to wait until you put a decat on and then see. I'd guess, with the cat and 4-2-1 the exhaust system is too restrictive. Ties in with your statement in bold above.

4-2-1's (or Tri-Y) are/were typically* geared towards gaining more midrange as opposed to 4-1's which are geared towards more peak power. Although this theory is becoming obselete to some extent nowadays, I would imagine it still applies in this case.

*typically - it is possible to move power bands (mean flow velocity) with either exhaust header/downpipe/manifold design depending on its diameter, tuned length etc.



tbf. if the 4-2-1 was a better mani for the car, youd think reno would have fitted one as std.

they chose not to. know wot theyre doing these little froggies.

Quite right...to a point.
The cars could have been designed with a catalytic converter in mind..hence possibly why kneesparks is seeing poor gains - a decat throws the original design out of the window.
As he is planning on having a de-cat fitted to the exhaust - I reckon the 4-2-1 will work out well.

Also, seen/heard of a couple of F7R hybrids make awesome power on rollers in standard form (170bhp+).
Will not gain that much power over standard from a rebuilt engine imo unless tolerances are tightended/worked on more closely (blueprinted) -

Nevertheless, the cars in question were using Valver manifolds with decats. Obviously the question of RR calibration comes up (even though there were comparable cars on the day to judge against...) ...
Although, we could start to think that maybe the 4-2-1 design with a decat works well as a system...

[sideways danny]

I cant think of a worse job that working with unterminated braided lines..

Bits if wire in your fingertips/under finger nails is not my idea of fun :lol:

Amen to that. Braided lines + PAS fluid leaking out while you're working = death by torture

[kneesparks]

It has a decat pipe n full ss zorst so not sure now. Will try resettin ecu n let ya know

[number1]

Does the 172 manifold mate up to the F7p/r Range then? i work in a hydraulics shop, so the skys the limit when it comes to plumbing and pipe bending and shaping 8)

[sideways danny]

Does the 172 manifold mate up to the F7p/r Range then? i work in a hydraulics shop, so the skys the limit when it comes to plumbing and pipe bending and shaping 8)

Quite a bit of cutting, welding and grinding back welds to give bolts clearance. Different flange so you'd need to have one made (I cut up a badly repaired williams manifold) but the port spacing is actually a very good match. I've not proved that it's a good upgrade yet but it follows in my mind that it should be taking into acount the huge similarity between the F4 and the F7

[kneesparks]

Right iv reset the ECU for 10mins and had a lil play down the road, feels alot better in lower gears with loads of torque steer in 2nd :twisted: so its pulling well again YAY! All I need now is to get it Chipped, where shaell i go for that, what sort of chip is best?? 8)

[number1]

Gunner chip is the only worthwhile chip in my opinion, but do not expect much at all! just a raised limiter and having to run on super unleaded, You wont feel that extra kick tbh have tried a Penneyduck chip off ebay for my old 1.8 and that was pretty good, but not sure on what the williams one would be like!

[richy]

better off getting it mapped properly tbh, wont get much if anything from a generic chip

[kneesparks]

Gunner would be fine, i must sort out a higher rev limmit as i keep hitting the std one at 6500RPM it comes way to fast and harsh, like iv just hit sumin :evil: So 7200RPM would be nice and maybe a set of cam's but they way to much at mo. :roll:

[Mr.AdamB]

manifolds dont really make that much difference anyway.... maybe get some improvement with a remap but hardly worth it unless u want cams etc, best off getting a gunnerchip trying that with the new manifold should make some difference.

i still think megane manifold is ftw....