Clio Cams

[Coggi]

Whats the best cams for a 2 litre bottom end with high compression pistons and lightened and balenced bottom end? It going to be fitted with a gas flowed Willy head and mappable Hill Power ECU.

Now im wondering what cams to look out for... And solid lifters?

What about fitting throttle bodies? Are they worth the extra cash, or can you get good gains through the standard (Flowed) inlet?

The car will be used on the track, and hardly ever on the commute to work so any suggestions?

Cheers Matt

[stan]

your cam profile is limited by the standard managment, or rather the MAP sensor and how it doesnt like lots of overlap.

I use/supply Catcams, www.catcams.be and from those specs, the 5502225 always prove to yield good results.

Throttle bodies are always a winner if the are within budget. The obviously need an "aftermarket" ecu which dont typically run a MAP sensor, so you have no limits here on your cam profile.

You really need to decide if t.b's are on the shopping list, then decide on cams to suit that set-up.

[mark]

if they are buy mine lol

mine are the cat cams 5502320's which use the solid lifters too. special price's :D

see the rest of my 2.0l engine sale in bits for sale section. :D

[Coggi]

Not so sure throttle bodies are on my list as i may end up racing the car yet and the championship doesnt allow them.

These cams that are on offer, are they race type or rally type cams?

How much are we talking?

[MAXIBOY]

hi mate. limiting factor is the standard management really.

cams are 450 quid.

[mark]

^^ and hes brought em :D

[snowman]

I have all of the same upgrades in my engine as you mention and ive gone for the CatCams from stan,fitting a KMS ecu tho as the standard ecu map is very restricting

[DaveH]

So if to have some wild spec cams you need aftermarket management, what are the options there ecu manufacturer wise? also what would be a rough cost of this upgrade?

[Coggi]

Yeah, what systems are out there that you guys have used.

I want some good usable power for track days that doent cost loads!!! (Dont we all....)

Is there anyway of improving the standard system by removing the problomatic MAP sensor????

Cheers for the advice so far guys.

[stan]

I use/supply KMS http://www.vankronenburg.nl/ ecu's.

They are very good value for money, and offer full engine control.

[DaveH]

So what would be a rough figure for the ecu and setup then stan?

[stan]

ECU is 420+vat, Mapping will be around 350-400.

[2 live]

never had any probs with the ecu for just cam upgrades tbh. but then on stock internals, and a cam to suit 260/270s you dont really need to upgrade the ecu rather than have it mapped.

for bodies. yes.

but for just cams/headwork, just get yours remapped on std ecu. cant say as iv seen/heard any similar specced cars but standalone ecu running quicker than mine tbh.

[DaveH]

So it doesnt need aftermarket management even if the cams require solid lifters with a high rev limit? Thats what it says on most cam websites.

[MAXIBOY]

yes with wild cams and solid lifters you will need aftermaket management to get it to run properly and have any chance of idle.

yet so see someone fit these cams yet as most run hydraulic tappets.

[DaveH]

I was hoping do do this and had a feeling the standard mapped management would be beyond its limits. What bottom end work would be a minimum requirement to use with a head setup like that- are we talking steel pistons/rods etc or could a standard f7r bottom end put up with this?

[stan]

"if your going to do it, do it properly".

If your building a decent spec NA motor, then buy H section rods, high comp forged pistons, and have the rotating masses dynamically balanced.
This way the bottom end is capable of revving to the powerband delivered by any cam you want...pretty much!

beyond 7500 you will require solid lifters. the cams mentioned above will likely stop mkaing power about there. beyond 8000 you really want to be looking at titanium valves.

[DaveH]

I see! Ideally itd just be a decent spec n/a i just wondered if its pheasable to build a quite highly specced top end whilst retaining a good (standard ish) bottom end until funds allow to build and adequate bottom end to put up with the extra revs the cams would demand. I dont want to go silly im just wondering if its possible to build an engine like this in stages as im quite a poor lad!?

[robi1000]

I'd like to ask what sort of cams and other mods would I need for around 170-180 PS (175bhp?) on a completly stock Willy. Exhaust, Cold air intake and which cams? Do I have to replace ECU for this horsepower?

Robi

[robi1000]

I'd also like to have as broad power band as possible (3000 - 7000RPM).

[2 live]

well. i had kent rn2002s fitted to mine, with just triple edged valves/seats on an otherwise std bym end/head, save for the uprated clutch, none lightened/balanced f/wheel, but then it only weighed 5.5kg s with the bolts ;), and had it remapped at chip wiizards. and to date, no other car has been quite as quick i dont think, unless theyv been lightened quite a bit.

most 2.0 s on here seem to be running pretty stripped trim wise, and have more headwork etc, but still running about same times down the strip, not really compared on road.


then the kent cams failed miserably wiping the top end out....thanks for fuk all kent.


am now running rn2003s , came cheap.lol.....with a prima big valve head....run it on the same remapped ecu i was using for the rn 2002s.



its also in a stripped car now....its not shy lol.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=duKeOfT1RC8


could do with the cams settin up properly, and a remap really...but doesnt seem to run bad as is for now ;)

[robi1000]

Why did your cams fail? And what else I'd have to change if I put rn2003s in? Are you running std ECU with modified chip? Sorry, but I'm a total n00b regarding cams.. :oops:

[2 live]

yes mate. std ecu with modded chip. new chip fitted wen mapped, its now a removable chip.



to run 2003s. there isnt really a lot u HAVE to do , bigger valves etc would be nice while ur at it. but not really essential.


altho i think on the website, they do recommend solid lifters with these cams.


my old ones failed due to the thrust washer disentegrating. was a common problem they denied, but revised the design anyway, and the pullies they make are like chocolate.

[robi1000]

So this rn2003 have revised design and that should not happen? Why do I need solid lifters? What is that anyway (I know what lifters are but what's the difference to std ones?). Which pullies should I use? I know this questions might be stupid, but like I said. I'm a "cam n00b". :D So, bear with me. :roll:

[2 live]

the tappets/lifters in the clio are hydraulic mate, but certain cam profiles are too harsh for them. i wouldnt use kent cams, but i use catcams pullies now.

[robi1000]

I did some research. For std BE and ECU cams up tu 260 are ok. With more aggressive profile you get idle problems etc. Where does your power band start and where does it end? What would be price in € with all the material involved (no labour)? What about fuel consumption? Is it dramatic decrease in milage?

[2 live]

well.like i said..i run rn2003s now, which are 270s. has a definitive lumpy idle. as cammed cars usually do, dependant on how theyr timed in etc.



http://youtube.com/watch?v=VKh7TZ7GlyU

this was with the bodies tho

power band starts bout 4k...up to redline at 7100.


price.dunno mate. as i said...i got these cheap

fuel comsumption. not too bad really. 700 miles inc. a trackday at spe and it was around £50 and 70EUROSin juice

[stan]

Revs kill hydraulics, rule of thumb is under 8k is fine. This is going to mean that the majority of profiles you are looking at are going to be fine for a std bottom end...especially on standard managment.

its worth noting that IF the powerband of the cam is genuinly under 8k rpm, regardless of if they are designated for solid lifters or not, they will be ok on hydraulic followers, since the ramp angles are actually harsher for a "hydraulic" profile as theres zero lash. so dont be totally put off if they state solids are required.