williams2 v x reg bmw 530

[david932]

this was the first proper thrash i've had in the wet since the remap..

pulled upon at a set of lights on the dc alongside a v6 vectra with a huge oval zost and tints. the lights changed got a good start with him a few car lenghs behind by the end of 1st. by the time i was hittin 3rd he had given up so i eased off, but flying up behind me was a set of angel eye headlight. i moved over 2 see wat it was, a 530 beemer on an x reg. decided to persue eager to find out how quick it was but there was a bit of traffic so we both stuck to about 80mph. got to the next round about dropped into 2nd and amazingly the beeemer started pullin away around the roundabout and exiting, meanwhile im feathering the throttle through 2nd.. in 3rd still feathering so'st not to spin the wheels. by this point he had pulled a decent 8 -10 car lenghs. by 4 grand in 3rd i thought fek feathering and planted the right foot, wheels scrambling for traction all the way to 7grand but imeediatly making good ground, got into 4th and stormed past with an impressive pace... bmw530 owned

was really surprised tho how such a big heavy car out handled me around a roundabout in the wet!

[J o n]

you lost 8-10 car lengths then pulled them back in the wet against a 530d?... sure it wasn't 8-10 uni-cycle lengths? sounds like he'd got bored and given up, you'd need more than the car can limit in 5th to pull back on one of these if it's that far ahead... these gave the old "one in front" trouble and are seriously seriously fast

[Chris n`nic]

Not a 530 d m8..just a 530 petrol I think....

Chris

[david932]

i never said deisel, but why is that so hard to believe? their only 193bhp, 1700kg and top out at 143. unless they took the "d" of the back i asume it was a petrol. witch is actually quicker!
look at the power to weights and compare them to a tuned williams.... theres not much in it

530d
http://www.parkers.co.uk/choosing/specs/data.aspx?model_id=78&id=20666

530 petrol
http://www.parkers.co.uk/choosing/specs/data.aspx?model_id=78&id=23186

[J o n]

530 and 530d are similar in terms of performance anyway, but they 1/4 mile in 15 seconds as standard! Forget letstorquebhp.com, it's wrong for the BMW's, they are much much faster than their power to weight, especially on the move... still not having 8-10 car lengths, as the speeds get faster so do these.. plus they also do a V8 which is even quicker... 6cly petrol is 215bhp and 215lbs/ft iirc, but will SQM in low 15's all day long... that's with 1700kg's as you say...

[Martin]

230 bhp / 150 mph+ they are not shy I had a doo with an particularly enthusiastic rep around some fast a roads in the old williams....was quite even really with me just able to close him down over a mile or two...

[Swervin_Mervin]

If a 530 was well in front in 3rd then it's good night Vienna. The weight and rwd will have helped him on the roundabout.

[Tommo]

He must have slowed down, prob didn't wanna lose his license!

I had a doo with one a few years back in my old 309 GTI which wasn't slow and it severerly handed my ass to me on a plate!

swervin, I would have thought rwd would have put him at a disadvantage on the wet on a roundabout??

[J o n]

should have slowed him down being wet and in an RWD car... the BMW's are notorious for misbehaviour in the wet, but I know most of this they attribute to the LSD... not sure if the 530's would have these? could have been an option, but it's more hindrance than help in the wet according to most enthusiastic BMW drivers. tbh on a motorway or any straight road I'd expect to be ahead from standing, then have it reel me in after about 80-100mph... then as the speeds increase I'd expect a proper pasting... myself, Gunner and 2 live all had a tussle with a 530d and everyone of us struggled with it, this being at speeds where the advantage would have been ours too imho

[Swervin_Mervin]

Tommo, think about it. RWD he gets a little oversteer at most, especially with that weight. FWD you scrabble for grip and veer wide.

I've been had before now on a r/bout by a XJR driven by an old guy in the wet. I just couldn't get the right balalnce of traction and direction. It was only once we got off the r/bout that I started to hand him his arse with a slight direction change, but he certainly backed off at that point.

I was on the o/s round the roundabout and was severely in danger of side swiping him had I not lifted a touch.

[Coops]

8-10 car lengths? thats a fahookin long way in front!! :shock:

[david932]

but doesn't the gearing on a williams make it quicker than its power to weight?

the bhp figures u quote are at the flywheel. being rwd they will have more transmission loss through the propshaft. and still weigh 1.5 ton

shouldn't be too hard to beat for a mildly tuned williams

i definatly had no problems passing him between 80 and 110

[Swervin_Mervin]

He must've lifted mate. At those speeds it's the torque that starts to show and the 530s have a fair bit I'd imagine. That's why the willy bums the valver once beyond 60/70

[J o n]

but doesn't the gearing on a williams make it quicker than its power to weight?

the bhp figures u quote are at the flywheel. being rwd they will have more transmission loss through the propshaft. and still weigh 1.5 ton

shouldn't be too hard to beat for a mildly tuned williams

i definatly had no problems passing him between 80 and 110

Willy's about as quick as it's power to weight... in fact it's pretty much bang on. the only thing they do with regularity is make over the standard quoted power. i seriously think the guy must have backed off, as a cam'd and mapped Williams would struggle... my money would still be on the BM at those speeds... easily. it's more power, more torque, geared for it and more aerodynamic.

[gtbloke]

That's why the willy bums the valver once beyond 60/70

LOL :lol:

[david932]

yeah maybe a 170-175bhp cammed chipped williams may struggle a bit but mine is running 192bhp. thats 195bhp per ton. in my calculations((230/1700)*1000) a 230bhp bmw weighing 1700kg only has 135bhp per ton. areodynamics only just start to come into effect at the speeds we were going. top speed the bmw has the advantage.. but by less than 10mph. if u look at the facts and figures on paper theres no reason why i wouldn't abliterate him

i cant believe that when some1's obviously up for giving thier car some stick thier going to ease off when a car that shouldn't be gaining on them is. but anyway...doesn't matter really i suppose :roll: :)

[J o n]

what mods are you running to get 192bhp? if your running that kind of power maybe then, but still not so sure about 8-10 car lengths, that tells me he let off some. they dont weight 1700kg's either, about 1600kg's and the stats for letstorquebhp if that's where you got them are prolly way off the mark... the older 530's can do 15.2 SQM's standard, that's with just under 200bhp iirc... not bad really, so motorway speeds they will haul ass.

some people let off as the speeds start to break the limit, my dad used to give our old Maxima 3.0 V6 some serious stick in 2nd when getting up to motorway speeds... he'd change to 3rd about 70mph and storm on to 80 before sticking there... ive let people go plenty of times when the speeds start getting silly, especially when the conditions are not favourable or there are other road users about, i guess it depends on the day itself and the sort of driver. some people dont care and will happily go to the limiter in 5th just to gain some advantage if they can, some wont...

[david932]

cams timed with verniers, headwork angled valves, ported, polished etc 4-2-1 supersprint, scorpion exhaust, decat live re-map@ chip wizards, group n clutch.

got the figures from parkers^^ and sorry u were right the petrol weighs 1635 and the deisel weighs 1700. but thats still only 140bhp per ton

the road was a dc, open for as long as i could see, wen i dropped it into 5th and eased off to about 100 to take my slip road he went tanking past me so i guess he was ok with the conditions and speeds.

maybe he did ease off.... or maybe he just didn't have enough power!

[JayR]

Does sound like a pretty drastic comeback but if you say so.

Am i correct by smelling that thejesus is a BMW head now!? Booooooo :D

[Purple]

Heh, doesn't matter what happens on a straight with a clio - it's the NOT winning the roundabout that's the shocker, IMO :D

That's one beemer driver with "I thrashed the world's best handling hothatch on a roundabout" story at the pub. And his mates would be telling him "No way" and that you must have backed off. :D

[J o n]

Does sound like a pretty drastic comeback but if you say so.

Am i correct by smelling that thejesus is a BMW head now!? Booooooo :D

I'm gonna get one yeah, but myself, 2 live and Gunner struggled with a 530d and RR figures asside I'd bet money on 2 lives car being quicker than a 192bhp Clio still... why? because I dont think they can make that on std inlet personally... unless TB's are crap as they made 216bhp on a more developed engine... but hey, there are some freak cars out there, I'm just not convinced at all by the 8-10 car lengths lost and gained back over the space of 1 and a half gear changes... some would say impossible, especially when 14 second cars struggle with them. This would be a 13 second Clio "easily" though, if the figures are right

Jay, still gonna keep my Clio mate, decided I've spent too much to bother selling it, so I'm taking it to the grave with me!

[david932]

as soon as i have access to a scanner i will post the rr printout or i could jus show lunner next week. on the it actually made 199.8bhp on the day but was corrected to 192 and that was with a leaking exhaust and feked lambda. no disrespect to any of the cars u just quoted but the reason they struggled is less power. simple.

as for wat 1/4 speed it'll do fcs comin, gonna be bookin sprint time so we'll see. jus look out for M932GGJ and a lad with a big afro 8)

[J o n]

an RR means nothing to me mate, not trying to take owt away from you but I doubt your running that sort of power from your spec, as there are countless others with similar and equal spec al running on average 20bhp down almost... in the 12 or 13 years these cars have been out no one has got near that power with those mods on std inlet... maybe if you had a steel bottom end or a TB setup, but if you do have that you've kept it quiet! lol

example:

my mates F7R engine: RR'd at over 180... imo it's not that high. it's got all the mods you have up there, minus the manifold and the engine has run a 14.2 iirc.

2 lives: same mods minus head work and manifold, ran 14.0 with just the back seats out, made around 170ish bhp...

If your coming to FCS you have to get on track, I'd like to see how quick it is for deffo, it should muller mine with that power.

[david932]

you can doubt it as much as you like, it doesn't change the facts! when talking bhp figures and 1/4 mile times 0.2 of a second and isn't anything. that could simply be down to driver ability gear changes and reaction time.

[J o n]

sorry for being sceptical mate, it was the 8-10 cars lost and gained over a couple of gears I cant believe...

I'm basing my thoughts on your car not being that high on bhp, I dont doubt the RR, as most simply make the figures up imo and are to be taken with a pinch of salt. Other cars with the same mods have been getting consistently less over the years, but maybe it is. We'll have to have a comparison at FCS, plenty of straight lines on Brunty track. Well, once I get the Kill Power ECU off my car anyway...