Uprated brakes provide no benefit if originals can lock?

[GabrielKnight]

What benefits are there of upgrading the disks and pads, if the original brakes can easily lock the wheels / trigger ABS on the Williams anyway?

The quickest way to slow down a vehicle is to apply just enough pressure to the brakes without the wheels locking / triggering ABS.

Given that the standard Wiliams will usually go into a skid / trigger ABS if travelling at speed then flooring the brake pedal, what is the advantage of buying stronger brakes that will presumedly just lock earlier?

[fabulicious]

http://www.autos.com/aftermarket-par...mprove-braking

[GabrielKnight]

I must admit I hadn't considered using more caliper pots but will look more into it. I can see how sharing the braking power across different areas would reduce fade.

However, I assume in the end it means using bigger / more calipers overall? I think this would be a step too far for me as I'm trying to keep my Willy as original as poss, which in my case means that there are no upgrades that can be observed with the casual eye.

I was thinking more about little cheat upgrades, like using ferodo ds2500 pads instead of the Renault ones. The 2500s get great reviews, but I can't see how they can stop the car any faster, for the reasons given before. If anything, as the brakes are stronger, I'd imagine that the initial bite to full on lock would be thinner and more difficult to guage with the foot.

[gdaniel]

Repeated braking builds up heat, as that rises other factors start coming into play like brake fade etc which can deminish the efficiency of the system. I understand ur theory but if u do a wee bit of reading up you wont be long in learning the ins and outs of such things. Cheers.

[gdaniel]

Pads can glaze up, cheaper disks can warp. If you want to uprate your brakes without affecting the looks your best bet would be good pads, quality disks, a good brake fluid with high wet and dry boiling points and some braided brake lines.

[gdaniel]

And the best brakes in the world are only as good as the tyre connecting you to the road. Shit tyres and u lock with ease, good tyres will help you stop better.[/list][/list]

[GabrielKnight]

I've honestly been reading about it all day. It becomes confusing because a lot of the reveiws for uprated pads seem to suggest that uprated pads slow the car more quickly in everyday road use. Can we agree that this isn't possible?

Regarding the brake fade issue, the problem I have is that any car going at a given speed will need to use the same amount of friction to bring it to a stop. Whether the pad is rough and slows down quickly or softer and takes more time, laws of physics asserts that the same amount of total friction must be equal to do the same job.

Any energy (including friction) ultimately becomes heat. Given that the same amount of friction is needed, the heat generated by a 'performance' pad will be the same (or greater because the slower brake has more time to cool).

The only answer I can think of is that the uprated pads contain compounds that still have gripping power at higher heats than the the original brakes can withstand.

So, is that all it comes down to? Uprated disks / pads provide no advantage when avoiding traffic on the way to work, but are designed to work better as the brake system heat rises?

[gdaniel]

Well in regardss to your first paragraph a one off stop will be negligible, however if u do ten hard stop in succession the uprated brakes should perform better. Hot brakes can be affected in a lot of different ways, from pad glaze to boiling fluid, but without getting into the science of it all, as far as ur concerned for daily commute / doddling about they will give you very little benefit.

[GabrielKnight]

K. At what point, if I use the ds2500s instead of the Renault pads, and use Castrol SRF, would I notice a difference?

Tbh, using the standard kit, there are times when I feel like I'm giving 9/10 on quiet uk roads up to an hour of fairly harsh driving / braking, but I've never felt brake fade.

Maybe it's because my tyres are near perfect, or others get even more speed / braking power, or down to my driving style, I've never had any problems. I haven't done any track days though.

Should I make the £100 upgrade to be on the safe side, or stick with what's worked?

[gdaniel]

Well, driving style is a huge factor in how any brake system performs for you, im not too clued up on the clio (im a honda n bmw man really) but from what most say on here, the std brakes are pretty decent as is. From what you say, id stick to genuine renault parts and some new decent fluid. Watch with some of the higher rated fluids as altho they have higher boiling points, they can also absorb moisture easier and thus need changed every 3-6 months depending. So id say genuine parts or if you really want to upgrade stick to reputable names such as ferodo/ pagid etc etc.