Can anybody say "Slammed ' NEW DAYLIGHT PICS

[Mish_16V]

These are in the running for crappest ever car pics 2005 but little teaser pics. Poor car is filthy as well, i've gone for the two tone sand/449 combo... but it's finally lowered and on it's arse. It sticks to the road so well, its like a completely different car. Any lower and it would be a crap ride and probably a tad unstable- seems to be pretty much perfect both ride and looks wise.... Will post daylight pics after it's bath tomorrow :D

Thanks
Mish

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1462.jpg


That wee speck of rust on the arch is getting anailated tomorrow to as thats the only bit on the car and i'm not having it eating away at my car!

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1469.jpg

[Jamie.]

wooooooaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh thats to low imo. have to kneel down to get in that!

[Mish_16V]

lmfao not quite.... :lol:

nah I was a bit worried i'd gone to low- but it can go lower, but garage did it low enough to look good, without comprimising handling or rubbing on the rear at all. Think it looks lower with the wheels looking so small.

It is like driving a completely different car now though :D

[Loz]

thats my kind of low...

when i get my coilovers mine is going to be just like that.

is your front the same? and how low is it.

nice car!!

[Scott-16v!]

:roll: how many times, theres no such thing as too low :lol: 8)
looks great mish, i think mine needs going a little lower now :D

[Mish_16V]

Fronts like this, its not lop-sided now it sits pretty much level...Not a great pic, before rear was done but you can see front level

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1458.jpg


It's on standard dampers at the rear :oops:

Full Bilstein Sprintline Kit should be coming in next week or so, so I will get that fitted asap, although i'm suprised at the lack of harshness in the ride- if anything its an improvement.... :shock:

It's only meant to be -35/40mm at front, god knows what would of happened if i'd of opted for the -60mm kit lol

[Zollo]

That's the trouble with a car with a torsion bar setup. People just slam it until they think it looks good and don't think about how it really handles. They think because a car moves around and the suspension compresses, it doesn't handle well. So when they remove all suspension movement, they think it's better. :roll:

[richy]

That's the trouble with a car with a torsion bar setup. People just slam it until they think it looks good and don't think about how it really handles. They think because a car moves around and the suspension compresses, it doesn't handle well. So when they remove all suspension movement, they think it's better. :roll:

true true












































bud-wis-er :P

[Mish_16V]

Sorry Captain Zollo :roll:

[Zollo]

:D

[Mish_16V]

:P

If you read my posts though you will see i've thought about it. It will go lower than that...but i left strict instructions with the garage...to make it look ok, level with the front but not low enough to comprimise handling or put unnessersary strain on the car...if it does get to much I will have it raised rather than ruin the car- i'm not THAT stupid lol :lol:

[Zollo]

I did read it, it's just that going on a post you made on another forum, I didn't think you'd quite grasped exactly what makes a car handle well.


Just making a stand for the standard Williams :wink:

[Mish_16V]

I no perfectly well what makes a car handle well...we can't always afford that perfect solution...Also mine isn't a track car, nor will it probably see track action until at least next summer. So to have a track set up with great handling wouldn't be right. Alls this car see's is road and lots of.

Mines only a valver anyway, and the suspension was shagged at that!!! So standard for me was really a pretty painful and unrewarding experience

I'm happy with it i have to say- and i still think it's like driving a completely different car. I no there's plenty of purists who say otherwise but riding on 10year original suspension just isn't healthy or fun in my opinion :D

[Martin]

low rider! lower than the nana maybe

[debottomley]

Nice. Hope you've done your brake bias valve.

[Mish_16V]

garage did it all..it wasn't something i fancied doing myself!

Brake bias has been done, headlights have been slightly adjusted etc etc.

Don't think it's quite as low as the nana Martin! will get daylight pics tomorrow and you can all carry on the slating then! Anyone would think you hadn't seen a lowered torsion bar before .

But i know i've broke the standard rules and i'll say my hale mary's before i go to bed. To be fair them pics are took on wonky ground lmao...i'll get some pics tomorrow of the car in a clean state on some straight ground!!! :oops: :lol:

[big hp]

Awwwww don't get upset, nobodys slating.

Looks very nice IMHO.

[craig100]

as sed already nobody slatin mate,we all together

[Mish_16V]

LOL upset...i'll get over the comments eventually... :cry: :lol:

I've been here long enough now to no Zollo is a true out and out standard williams man! It's nice to have critiscm anyway as with you lot it usually is for the best and makes sense.

Cheers for all comments. Will get some decent pics on straight land once i've been to wash the poor thing!

Mish

[stew]

It looks good IMO 8)

Nobody was slating. Zollo was just giving his side of the argument (so to speak)

The fact in the matter is....as far as im concerned.... on standard shocks the rear will drop as low as -120mm. doing this will give no movement in the rear shocks meaning that they are always compressed. this is not good for the shocks and not good for handling.

It means that there will be little or no damping done by the shock absorber, hence making a bumpy ride, and causing handling problems. a really stiff rear end of a car will make it prone for oversteer (im not saying lowering a car more at the rear than the front will give oversteer...quite the opposite - understeer) and very skittish over bumps.

However - the clio has fook all weight in the back (especially when stripped), so having little movement in the rear of the suspension is not that much of a problem, because the front suspension will be doing all the work, suporting the heavy F7P or F7R engine, gearbox and other components. So if your front suspension is working well, then the rear can almost be left to do what it wants.

Having a car lowered more at the back than the front induces understeer, something that is not what makes a car go quick round corners! Ideally you want the front to be about 15-20mm lower than the rear, giving a more progressive stance, balancing more weight forward, giving better turn into corners. Also having the rear suspension set more stiff than the front will induce oversteer, but this time is reducing the amount of grip the rear of the car has, reducing overall grip and producing some nasty moments when the back end decides to let go!

Also some people think that slamming a car will make it handle much better, much more stable round corners. Lowering the centre of gravity will enhance road holding ability. This is ture to a certain extent, but without stifferening the anti-roll bars, and uprating the bushes the car will still have a tendancy to "roll" just the same when entering a corner.

Setting suspension up is all about comprimise. If you want the best handling then you mite have to comprimise looks slightly and set it up a little higher all round, allowing a bit more suspension movement. Hence what Zollo was saying. :wink:



I found that with my coilover kit (where the front is lowered about 45mm) the rear shocks are such that if i lower the rear more than about 60mm, the shocks will sit on the bumpstops, effectivly doing nothing. Currently i have the rear torsion bar adjusted so that the front is about 15mm lower than the rear, giving great handling at some sacrifice of looks. I'm kinda unsure whether running the rear shocks closer to the bumpstops than they are just now (becuase my car is fully stripped, meaning there is very very little weight in the rear and no passengers) would make the handling worse. The rear shocks are so stiff anyway (un-adjustable) and the amount of weight in the rear being nill, i think (after winters over) i will try lowering the rear more (maybe another 20 or 25mm) and lowering the front the same will improve things. :?

Suppose its just trial and error until you get some sort of setup that suits you and your driving style and makes you feel comfortable in the car. Just make sure the "error" part dosent involve a ditch or tree!

Bit of a ramble, but hey :)

[Mish_16V]

Not a ramble at all a really interesting read thanks!

...the rear shocks arn't compressed fully and there is still travel on them so as far as I know they arn't bottomed to their limit, thats definetly not what I wanted!

I don't want to be someone who comprimises looks for handling as thats definetly what owning a valver is about. I'm looking into getting some of the "shortened" shocks you can own especially for lowered cars that Wez from here was chatting to me about last night and once christmas is gone some coilovers as I don't want the car to be a 'bodge' I want it all done properly.

Cheers for your input though it was much appreciated :) I think i've come across wrong in this thread lol, i wasn't having a go at Zollo and the likes...I just no he knows his cars and loves his standard willy setups :D

[stew]

Cool! 8)

On a slightly different note....

Anyone with lowered 16v or williams...what shocks are you using and how low have you gone? The rear shocks on my Ultimate Coilover kit dont seem to be that short! Anyone else near the limit at the height of the shocks?

Gaz_Two - Whats it like on the back of the nana? I know its pretty damn low!

[Lunner]

Welcome to understear

[Mish_16V]

Lunner...makes a change from oversteer :lol: Anyway here she is, i've seen lower to be honest. I've been on a long drive in it today and i'm still impressed :D

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1473.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1474.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1485.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1475.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1483.jpg

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c19/Mish_1986/000_1478.jpg

[Scott-16v!]

very 8) looks great mish :D

[TriO`]

looks amazing. love it! 8)

[Gav]

looks awsome, good job fella

[Jamie.]

looks awsome, good job fella


mish is short for michelle.......

[Scott-16v!]

^^PMSL!! :lol:

[Mish_16V]

lmfao... not again!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[freebone16v]

looks awsome, good job fella

yep again mish....lol
i was the first...sorry bout that

car looks mint...initially i thought it looked to low but it looks good

[Zollo]

Ordinarily I wouldn't have said anything on this thread, but I just thought the whole thing was a little ironic after Mish had said this elsewhere :shock: ...


The williams was on standard suspension...and frankly it was dire round them corners.

Torsion bars are the wankiest thing ever. Great for making your car look nice by getting it slammed, but the handling at the rear at speed

I thought Mish would have twigged what I was on about and taken what I said with a pinch of salt :oops:

For the record, though, I reckon a factory fresh standard Williams will pan a lowered one that hasn't had a professional, or at least very well considered, setting up.

:twisted:

[Zollo]

Good post btw Stew. Nothing wrong with a bit of a ramble :)

[Andy]

who is that rs turbo in the pic looks nice

[Mish_16V]

RS Turbo's is my cousins Andy.

Zollo I completely see where your coming from...but think that quote of mine was from a thread about a track day or similar. I may be wrong, i'm stupid!

I am in agreement that a without a proper set up a standard williams would trounce an over-lowered car round a track. But as said mine won't be going anywhere near a track until next summer now and to me for on the roads it is handling excellent.

Think i came across wrong Zollo- we are all definelty entitled to opinions and I respect what you say as its obvious you know your cars and obviously in particular you're clios! It was taken with a pinch of salt matey and as said I respect your comments and all feedback, both good and bad is useful to me.

Any lower and I think the car would of been really dire. I'm all for having a go at doing stuff myself on the car, but I wouldn't like to cock something like the torsion bar up. I took it to a garage that does them everyday and left them with strict instructions to lower as much as poss without making the tyres foul on the arches, the suspension bottom out or the handling be comprimised to much on the road. And i feel they've done exactly that!

I haven't took offence by any comments and i'm glad you all took the time to put you're views across...whatever they maybe. Hope this clears things up and makes me look less like a clueless contradicting schoolgirl!!!

Cheers
Mish :D

[Zollo]

Zollo I completely see where your coming from...but think that quote of mine was from a thread about a track day or similar. I may be wrong, i'm stupid!



Yeah, it was after you'd watched the Willy wobble its way around the track. The only reason the it looked a bit sketchy was because I wasn't driving, erm, how it should be driven. :oops:

Although no way as good as independant rear suspension, torsion bar setups do work perfectly well. And as you say, they also make it very easy to lower a car to make it look nice...like yours :wink: :)

[Mish_16V]

I can't mock you to much...you stayed on the track which is probably more than i'd manage :lol:

Cheers for the input though, it has been useful :D

[FATBOY]

i take it your a bit impartial to the odd caravan holiday??

[Scott-16v!]

pmsl^

[Mish_16V]

No i'm a pikie :lol:

No my dad owns a storage company...half of which is caravans- stores classic cars etc to but i wanted to add the pikie "edge" to my pics :lol:

Looks nice mich!

looks a lot lower in the first pics tho :shock:

liking the bump strips aswell :D

Thought your car was mint tho, no rust :shock:

LMAO @ the caravans, you will never get away with the name thing aswell :D

[Swervin_Mervin]

I think you'll probably find that if you aren't using your car on track much, you're much better off with a more standard ride height and damping, whereas a more lowered and stiff setup will be better on the track.

[Mish_16V]

oh yes the old surface rust on the sill dave...that's what happens when you leave it on the seafront for four nights :(

Thats gone now to thank fek :D

Still really happy with it and the way it's driving etc :D

[VIPERONE]

whatever winstons set up is..thats the setting i'd go for..****in hell i endured his demo run around his local industrial estate... it was ridiculous!
by far the best handling clio ive sat in...along with 2live.

[Mish_16V]

Think Winstons is in a league of its own away from mine though it all fairness G :lol:

[Andyvalver]

Looks 8) :evil:

[kj16v]

#-o ew! nasty!