View Full Version : Turbo @ Pod 12.3@ 117mph
Got my arm twisted into going to santa pod today, Dan el turbo man has been pestering me for weeks to go and i eventually caved in
initial plan was to run his car and i'd just passenger down, but in end i took the turbo..........couldn't resist!!!
had a cracking day and laid down my best time yet, finally set a couple of decent 60ft's as well peak being the best run!
i got consistently into the mid 12's most of the morning, and eventually just before lunch struck into the low's with a 12.36@117mph. 60ft or 2.06 :-) :-) olay!!!
and this is from a car that split a pipe on way down and was botched up oin tesco carpark again, after the fiasco with radiators and head tanks at mallory as well!
still confused about the header tank pressure issues but after re-routing the turbo water pipes the issues seems less pronounced, so roll on donny, see how it goes :-)
then after lunch me and dan swapped cars and had a blat in each others, both to fairly useless effect! weird as i cant drive his and he could only crack 12.9 in mine as well, madness!!!lol!!!
then we had the inevitable incident, dan's second gear decided it had had enough and ran off into the sunset, so off home he limped!!! quick swap ready for donny on the cards now!!
cheers to Dan and Bacon for a top day!
slip below for your delectation folks!!
cheers
Coops
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a330/coopahstar/Turbo/Photo0282.jpg
Kingscott
02-07-2011, 08:19
That's a quick little 5 turbo! Whats the spec ? If you need any advice regarding the water system give me a shout, owned my 5 for 10 years, not much I don't know about lol.
zmaster2k
02-07-2011, 08:44
It's a Clio dude! 1.8 16v turbo
Kingscott
02-07-2011, 08:51
Ah, sorry saw the slip, didn't read it correctly.
:)
lol, it was RTOC pod day, but mines still a renault turbo, just not as renault intended! ;-)
You're not right on that one Coops.
Someone told me at first Renault intended to make the clio's turbocharged but due to emission and other rules they didn't do it.
A shame they didn't design the gearboxes for that kind of violence. Would make things alot easier!!
Nice time man! You might consider about going the vr6 gearbox route too.
A sper diff costs half the money of a jc5 one. The ratio's are lot better for turbo use and last but not least.
A bone stock vr6 gearbox can handle 350hp and more then 350 lb/ft without breaking :shock:
Coffee Mug
02-07-2011, 14:27
Anyone any idea what a standard mk2 clio cup race car would do?
About mid 14's
Rappido that Coops!!!
Coffee Mug
03-07-2011, 11:48
About mid 14's
Rappido that Coops!!!
Mid 14s?
I doubt that very much. Some road cars can egde that.
Anyone with an informed opinion?
depends who drives it mate?
What spec?? bhp and does it have a normal box or sequential?
Coffee Mug
03-07-2011, 17:29
depends who drives it mate?
What spec?? bhp and does it have a normal box or sequential?
:roll:
About mid 14's
Rappido that Coops!!!
Mid 14s?
I doubt that very much. Some road cars can egde that.
Anyone with an informed opinion?
They arent significantly quicker in a straight line than a standard road car.
Would murder coops round a track though, lol
Good result coops, quick car!
volymmannen
04-07-2011, 10:06
You're not right on that one Coops.
Someone told me at first Renault intended to make the clio's turbocharged but due to emission and other rules they didn't do it.
A shame they didn't design the gearboxes for that kind of violence. Would make things alot easier!!
Nice time man! You might consider about going the vr6 gearbox route too.
A sper diff costs half the money of a jc5 one. The ratio's are lot better for turbo use and last but not least.
A bone stock vr6 gearbox can handle 350hp and more then 350 lb/ft without breaking :shock:
How much pain in the ass to fit ???
adaptor plate to get engien onto gearbox, new mounts, new shafts.
TBH if you are doing that though, makes far more sense to just fit the audi engine too!
Adaptor engine >gearbox
Adaptor crank>flywheel
Golf mk4 shifter box
Custom mounts
Custom shafts
Hyd clutch or seat clutch push meganism for cable use
Relocating of tdc sensor (triggerwheel or something like it)
volymmannen
04-07-2011, 12:17
How about a megane rs box will it fit better, should last longer than a jc5 i think. yes it woluld be better to take a complete audi engine gearbox but i have i new built megane engine with new stronger rods and low comp pistons and everything, will try a jc5 box for starters, and don't go nuts with mapping it for max power. my plan is not going 402m, i want a nice torque curve for track use..
Coffee Mug
04-07-2011, 12:26
About mid 14's
Rappido that Coops!!!
Mid 14s?
I doubt that very much. Some road cars can egde that.
Anyone with an informed opinion?
They arent significantly quicker in a straight line than a standard road car.
Would murder coops round a track though, lol
Good result coops, quick car!
Didnt Palmersport test the 0-100 of their cup race cars at 10.something seconds?
Seems a fair bit quicker than a road car to me.
Coffee Mug
04-07-2011, 12:28
And if its a 1/4 mile car, i cant see the point of any synchro box. Dog gears is the only solution.
Coffee Mug
04-07-2011, 12:42
Just checked, the MK2 race cars did 0-100 in 10.5 seconds according to Renaultsport
Just checked, the MK2 race cars did 0-100 in 10.5 seconds according to Renaultsport
Still only a low 13 then realistically I would think, Im sure coops would win on a quarter, they arent about straight lines, they are about corners.
The difference in handling is a lot more than the difference in power I would wager although ive not personally driven one.
How about a megane rs box will it fit better, should last longer than a jc5 i think. yes it woluld be better to take a complete audi engine gearbox but i have i new built megane engine with new stronger rods and low comp pistons and everything, will try a jc5 box for starters, and don't go nuts with mapping it for max power. my plan is not going 402m, i want a nice torque curve for track use..
If you want to use the megane rs box, then use the megane rs block too.
Anyrg did it the other way around IIRC, building a megane turbo engine into a 172 block, so you should be able to do the opposite with the engine you have built going into a later type block.
Only guessing though, havent personally done it.
Im going honda engine and box for mine, 600bhp capable box with an LSD as standard, and an engine tha will do 300bhp with minimal modifications in a donor car you can buy for a grand.
Will be lots of hassle to fit but once im done at least then its cheap to maintain.
Done 8 renault boxes in my trackday car in only a few thousand miles, gets very tiresome keep changing them!
iirc the 225 Box is massive, thats why Andy didnt run it. 172cup box's are ment to be stronger but there are not that many about with the manual output for the speedo.
As for adaptor plates to Vag gearbox's Scoff made one for his F4r powered R5. was running 450bhp iirc through an 02j box (Golf Mk4) with lds and slicks so its pretty strong (10.2 1/4miles)
hes now changing to an 02M box because the syncros were not great at high revs.
tbh im not sure you need lsd on track with a good setup and some decent tyres
tbh im not sure you need lsd on track with a good setup and some decent tyres
FPMSL
Do you mean on track, or on the strip?
As if you actually mean on track then I take it you havent ever done a trackday in a powerful FWD car?
LSD is absolutely essential when talking 300bhp and FWD!
On the drag strip, i would say its essential too, but even more so on the track.
FPMSL
Do you mean on track, or on the strip?
As if you actually mean on track then I take it you havent ever done a trackday in a powerful FWD car?
LSD is absolutely essential when talking 300bhp and FWD!
On the drag strip, i would say its essential too, but even more so on the track.
PMSL
on the Race Track yes, 1/4 Mile is essential.
Ive owned a few fast fwd cars and never had a serious issue round Bedford, Oulten and Donny. :wink:
Coffee Mug
04-07-2011, 19:36
And just why are '172 cup boxes' meant to be stronger?
What engineering reason is there for this?
cos the diffs bolted in rather than circlipped.....c'mon rob you know this. :roll:
nice time coops :) would like your opinion and knowladge on a few things at some point in the future :)
my main worry now is gearbox :( how long is a jc5 likely to last with general road driving on a turbocharged f7r? no idea on torque figure but i bilieve it should be running around 250 bhp.
is it massive work to get an NDO box fitted to a F7R block? im not worried about space its just the mounting to the engine im worried about the most
I considered fitting a 225 box too but then there is another problem. The ratio's...
Meggie has fairly bigger tyres then a clio. I haven't calculate it but won't be surprised if the top end is even lower then a jc5..
6 gears with even lower top is not what you're waiting for with a turbo'ed engine!
ran mine for two years on the road with uprated box and diff no issues with gearbox running 18 inch rims and 225/35 18's
mine will be standard high miler megane jc5's untill i can fit a better box lol
Coops saw your Clio going up the strip on the Friday and had a chat with you the car is awesome was very quick. Looks like I am on the hunt for a 172 box :D Shame about AfroDan's car and his 2nd gear going
.....c'mon rob you know this. :roll:
ohhh Thought it was Rob........ Hi Rob :lol:
isnt Dan running a std 1.9D box? or was at least. Oh and ref the 172 Box it was something i heard/Read ive never pushed a renault box in any other form than std. Although i did buy a 172cup with a broken box (circlip jumped out like the valvers box's) so maybe there not super strong :roll:
As for fitting the Vag box, apart from the obvious bits i know the box is v close to the rack and subframe so they may need adjusting.
volymmannen
04-07-2011, 23:20
iirc the 225 Box is massive, thats why Andy didnt run it. 172cup box's are ment to be stronger but there are not that many about with the manual output for the speedo.
I heard that all 172 boxes had manual speedo output,Massive like in too ****ing big to fit or what?
volymmannen
04-07-2011, 23:23
How about a megane rs box will it fit better, should last longer than a jc5 i think. yes it woluld be better to take a complete audi engine gearbox but i have i new built megane engine with new stronger rods and low comp pistons and everything, will try a jc5 box for starters, and don't go nuts with mapping it for max power. my plan is not going 402m, i want a nice torque curve for track use..
If you want to use the megane rs box, then use the megane rs block too.
Anyrg did it the other way around IIRC, building a megane turbo engine into a 172 block, so you should be able to do the opposite with the engine you have built going into a later type block.
Only guessing though, havent personally done it.
Im going honda engine and box for mine, 600bhp capable box with an LSD as standard, and an engine tha will do 300bhp with minimal modifications in a donor car you can buy for a grand.
Will be lots of hassle to fit but once im done at least then its cheap to maintain.
Done 8 renault boxes in my trackday car in only a few thousand miles, gets very tiresome keep changing them!
:mechanic: :gears:
.....c'mon rob you know this. :roll:
ohhh Thought it was Rob........ Hi Rob :lol:
isnt Dan running a std 1.9D box? or was at least. Oh and ref the 172 Box it was something i heard/Read ive never pushed a renault box in any other form than std. Although i did buy a 172cup with a broken box (circlip jumped out like the valvers box's) so maybe there not super strong :roll:
As for fitting the Vag box, apart from the obvious bits i know the box is v close to the rack and subframe so they may need adjusting.
yeah the cup box is 'the' box supposedly to give you the bolt in diff with the cable drive, best of both worlds. all others were electric speedos??
16v_paddy
05-07-2011, 01:11
yeah the cup box is 'the' box supposedly to give you the bolt in diff with the cable drive, best of both worlds. all others were electric speedos??
Pretty sure I've read somewhere that the bolt in diff was only fitted to the latest 172's & all 182's & that all subsequent reconditioned boxes have it
^^^ sounds about right my 03 172 cup was defiantly a circlip because it failed and the replacement one was also a circlip. I'm asuming you can bolt the 182 box to the f7r then but you won't have a Speedo. The 182 and later 172's read from the abs sensor for speed.
There are a few guys running 280bhp supercharged 172's do might be worth speaking to them for some input. As for the 225 box I think size wise it's too big. I remember Stan was gonna fit one into a 172 and the diff housing was bigger. The mk2 engine bay is deeper and wider than the Williams.
Flan
volymmannen
05-07-2011, 08:12
yeah the cup box is 'the' box supposedly to give you the bolt in diff with the cable drive, best of both worlds. all others were electric speedos??
Pretty sure I've read somewhere that the bolt in diff was only fitted to the latest 172's & all 182's & that all subsequent reconditioned boxes have it
Jc5089 has cable i have a reconditioned jc5089 as its called jc5s something lets hope the diff is changed to a better one :D
only late 172/182's have bolt in std and as said they are all abs sensored for speed so no use. the early ones still use lecci speedo, just its a plug into cable output on the box, rather than abs. so just whip sensor out and whack cable in
172 box i have seems to be standing up well so far......
dan had a standard megane tdi box in his just, silly long rations, it topped out at 170 nearly, with theoretical of 186 i think, but not enough grunt to get there!!!lol!!
6 speed will fit as few have got the lot from a megane 225 into the clio mk1 bay, but it involves subframe chopping and rewelding to fit the housing in, i think diff clearance is okay though
FPMSL
Do you mean on track, or on the strip?
As if you actually mean on track then I take it you havent ever done a trackday in a powerful FWD car?
LSD is absolutely essential when talking 300bhp and FWD!
On the drag strip, i would say its essential too, but even more so on the track.
PMSL
on the Race Track yes, 1/4 Mile is essential.
Ive owned a few fast fwd cars and never had a serious issue round Bedford, Oulten and Donny. :wink:
If you have been driving a 300bhp FWD car round bedford and not had an issue with one wheel lighting up when you put the power on then you certainly havent been driving anywhere near as hard as I like to do so!
DEFINATELY an LSD is of massive benefit there, try one and then you will see what I mean and you'll never want to go back to without!
Oh im not denying it has bennifits and is a worthy upgrade im saying its not essential, as in “the power will be pointless without one”
As for driving hard, (without sounding like a big headed knob) I think there are a few people on here that will confirm I drive pretty hard on track but im no racing driver! BUT everyone drives different. Some constantly push the front causing understeer..if its understeering and then you plant it its gonna spin. I prefer slow in fast out, again horses for courses??
Im just baising my knowledge on my Clio that was running a 279bhp/280ft/lb 1.8T, coilovers and Ex Cup slicks (same grip as R888)
What are you basing yours on just out of interest.
Oh im not denying it has bennifits and is a worthy upgrade im saying its not essential, as in “the power will be pointless without one”
Well coming out of the vast majority of corners thats EXACTLY the case, the extra power will be utterly no use to you at those points, and getting your speed back up ASAP after the apex is essential to making good progress.
Have you ever actually driven a powerful fwd car with an LSD?
If not its kind of hard to explain, like trying to explain to someone who has only ever had a wank that a woman is better than your hand, till you try it you wont actually understand.
As for driving hard, (without sounding like a big headed knob) I think there are a few people on here that will confirm I drive pretty hard on track but im no racing driver! BUT everyone drives different. Some constantly push the front causing understeer..if its understeering and then you plant it its gonna spin. I prefer slow in fast out, again horses for courses??
You'll be able ot put more power down on the way out, so come out faster with an LSD.
Pointless me going on about it though, just try one and either it will be very apparent exactly what im saying, or perhaps you just drive gentley enough that to you personally it wont make any real benefit, like you say we are all different.
Im just baising my knowledge on my Clio that was running a 279bhp/280ft/lb 1.8T, coilovers and Ex Cup slicks (same grip as R888)
What are you basing yours on just out of interest.
Im basing mine on a massive variety of FWD cars with power outputs from 100bhp mini trackday car to 400bhp mk2 astra fwd trackday car all driven on track over the last 15 years of being into trackdays, and in many cases having driven the same car with and without an LSD.
You seem to be making a comparison of one car without a LSD to NO cars with one, LOL
So basically, one of us is making a very informed appraisal of the benefits based on a massive amount of experience, and you are guessing, lol
Seriously mate, fit one and you'll never look back!
SWEET! well my new clio has more power so no doubt i'll be eating my own words very soon and a nice piece of humble pie :lol:
however.... This is a debate about High Powered Clio's putting the power down which handle allot different to Astra's/Novas/Corsa's/Mini's....ect so you seem to be making a comparison of one car with great handling and grip level to a Vauxhal :lol: :lol:
SWEET! well my new clio has more power so no doubt i'll be eating my own words very soon and a nice piece of humble pie :lol:
Even on a dry day and with only the fairly moderate power level before you would have noticed a massive difference if you tried it with a diff, my clio is 170bhp and utterly screaming out of a diff on some of the 2nd gear corners on tighter tracks even with that power level, and its on ledas and proper geometry and always run on pilot sport cups or a048r or 888 so its not like im short on grip but when you get weight transfer at the apex you end up without much grip on the inside wheel, the laws of physics just wont let it happen any other way!
My mate has a thorttle bodied 172 cup for example and with only about 200bhp and even in that its night and day different with the diff in it!
And as soon as the track is damp, even more so.
however.... This is a debate about High Powered Clio's putting the power down which handle allot different to Astra's/Novas/Corsa's/Mini's....ect so you seem to be making a comparison of one car with great handling and grip level to a Vauxhal :lol: :lol:
Fair point on the vauxhalls although actually a car that doesnt handle well shows up even more how much benefit a diff can make, a nova with a diff will leave you for dead pulling out of a corner despite yours having more natural grip from a better chassis.
You dont think track prepped mini's handle well though? seriously?
screaming out FOR a diff that should have said, ****ing edit button!
yer...retract the Mini one.... :lol:
well its on my Loooonnnngg list of things to get so only time will tell.
cliopete
05-07-2011, 11:26
My Reault recon box fitted about three years ago has definitely got the bolt in diff.
Pete
yer...retract the Mini one.... :lol:
well its on my Loooonnnngg list of things to get so only time will tell.
It will make you quicker round a lot of tracks than your extra power will I would wager, especially if its damp.
:D
zmaster2k
05-07-2011, 23:53
My Reault recon box fitted about three years ago has definitely got the bolt in diff.
Pete
Yes but not a LSD......mine has a bolt in....I know this, but not an 900 quaife diff I really want!
I'vegotadiffandyoudon'trealisehowmuchofadifference itmakes.Lookslikemyspacebarsshagged:(
It would appear that a spacebar affects readability as much as a decent diff affects handling :shock:
cliolord
06-07-2011, 18:50
I ran a diff in my Clio. Before the JC5 gearbox casing exploded, it was stunning. The car was transformed. Since the box blew up, I fitted a standard open diff JC5, the cars never felt close to great and so I went out and bought an Evo instead. Jumped back in the Clio the other day and now im highly considering breaking it. It really is pretty cack without the diff, although that said had I never driven it with the diff I'd probably still be happy with it now
evo??? bloody hell my estimation of the lord has faltered ;-)
nice going there coops, certainly still a quick motor! :)
I must say that the Clio 1.9D box im running on mine is still going strong.
Ratios are crazy :D
Get about 100-110 in 2nd gear...
And the turbo doesnt have enough grunt to push it to hard in 5th...
i should really get a new ecu and crank the boost some more.
But then its not been out of the garage this year lol, still busy making it look pretty :)
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