View Full Version : 172's SUCK SUCK SUCK SUCK SUCK.....
Can anyone say engine seized ten times fast?
I want the willy back!
This can't be a coincidence that it had to have new belts and pulleys etc.. due to aux belt failure less than 1k ago, it took the cambelt with it and bent the valves, now approx 800 miles later it seems (without checking) to have gone again.
Thing is theres no come back with it - the work was done for the lady owner who had it from new before me, it was at the garage it was always serviced and mot'd at and I have lots of reciepts to backup everything thats ever been done to the car - she was just lapse with teh aux belt change and it went due to age.
Gonna have to pull my pants down and get it fixed. was well ****ing fast today too I was just starting to really like it!
Just spend £130 on a brand new spiltter too! :evil:
Unlucky my 172 is going really, really well. Feels smooth and very solid in the engine department.
It was awesome today I really enjoyed it till this happened.
Don't know what to do about it now, I'd rather not go down the new engine route but totally depends how bad it is.
Cams FTW! :lol:
Its at the rocket center hopefully feeling very sorry for itself.
Justin..
20-03-2009, 01:22
you ever heard thatan engine is at its fastest before an epic failure? happened in my valver :(
gutting news tho man!!!
get your overalls on !
I can't help feel these are made of cheese compared to the F7's - read so many horror stories about 172s killing themselves!
I'm off to cry :cry:
16v_paddy
20-03-2009, 09:35
What you doing, fixing that lump or getting a reolacement? There's a couple of 172 lumps on ebay for a few hundred quid :wink:
It's not just renault engines, my corolla went ballistic just before the engine blew up in spectacular fashion while having "a play" with a copper in a T5 :P
FlamingMonkey
20-03-2009, 11:15
If the car is at Jordys, get an engine from Matts in Accy it will be pricey to rebuild!
Who did the belts?
Has the engine gone twice did you say?
Unlucky fella!
FlamingMonkey
20-03-2009, 11:16
you ever heard thatan engine is at its fastest before an epic failure? happened in my valver :(
gutting news tho man!!!
get your overalls on !
Happended in my valver too, then bang!
faf, mk2 of fail
altho sorry to hear its going to be expensive lad, not good news :(
Disagree with the above posts about a replacement engine.
How do you know that engine isn't going to be ****ed too?
I'd much rather spend some dollar getting the engine rebuilt to a high standard with new seals, bearings, belts etc for total peace of mind.
FlamingMonkey
20-03-2009, 13:48
Disagree with the above posts about a replacement engine.
How do you know that engine isn't going to be f**ked too?
I'd much rather spend some dollar getting the engine rebuilt to a high standard with new seals, bearings, belts etc for total peace of mind.
For sure, but at the accy breakers they guarantee the engine, if it dont work they replace it, I know its not cheap to put it in to find its goosed, but the price of an engine replace over a rebuild, well for a proper job at a garage aint gonna be cheap!
Although if my engine had gone pop 2 times I wouldn't be rebuilding it again thats for sure!
New engine, then flog it!
P3WNED cliosport.net style :D
F7p/r it Fur Den Gewinn !!!! 8)
It obviously wasn't done right the first time if it is indeed that - might not be that yet until its been looked over.
Its gonna cost ££ to find out whats wrong with it and take it apart, waste of money if your going to just chuck a replacement in on top of it.
**** knows
Just been informed that they're going to be laying of 50 workers at our place so I might not have any money to pay for it yet. no-ones safe.
bad news matey :(
There's a couple of 172 lumps on ebay for a few hundred quid
that would be my choice could have it in and out in a few days i couldnt afford to hire a car to get me to work n back while the engine is being examined and rebuilt would take ages i think ?
I really would rather not go down the unkown engine route - could cost you a shit load more in the long run.
I can just about cope without a car for a few weeks.
Sorry to hear about your 172.....daz this is no comfort...but my r5 up for sale on forum....sprung an oil leak behind flywheel....frggin engine out an new clutch etc .
overalls out next week an get shitty im affraid...its the way of the petrol head..hmmmmm
theres nothing wrong with f4r its shitty mechanics who dont know what there messing with
theres nothing wrong with f4r its shitty mechanics who dont know what there messing with
yes there is, its a butt ugly engine :wink:
They look Puuurdy with the engine cover on though!
I'll be keeping it, if I threw in the towel every time the valver or the willy broke I'd have been selling them every other week!
Righto updates: we're 90% sure the bottom pulley nut/screw whatever has not been done correctly and spun knoking of the timing? does that make sense? I was struggling to make use of the info I was being told lol I'm more a wires man not an oil guru...
So all the belts are intact etc...
Just waiting back on the garage that did the work.
yea daz sounds right, if nut came loose pulley would slide forward off key an spin on crank shaft.
col
yeah thats right, the crank isnt on a keyway so the pulley needs to be tightened correctly otherwise the crank can move independantly to the timing belt etc
Tow truck sorted for tomorrow morning then its off back to the garage...
All's should have it back soon enough :D
yeah thats right, the crank isnt on a keyway so the pulley needs to be tightened correctly otherwise the crank can move independantly to the timing belt etc
So what kind of damage are we looking at then? what will need replacing again?
I want to make sure I know its right this time!
Valves mainly ,dependant what speed you were doing at time of damage piston marked on top.
worst scenario.......head damaged ,bores scored con rod bent. :(
as col said, most likely just valves but at worst may of damaged the head/pistons/rods etc if you was at 7k rpm etc lol
sorry didnt mean to lol, thats just at the 7k remark i put!
not a nice position to be in as ive been there a few times!
yeah thats right, the crank isnt on a keyway so the pulley needs to be tightened correctly otherwise the crank can move independantly to the timing belt etc
So what kind of damage are we looking at then? what will need replacing again?
I want to make sure I know its right this time!
There all Floating pulleys, Your meant to lock the crank and camshafts using a special kit and then fit the belt, refit bottom pulley, and tighten top pulleys if you have loosened them,
I think its impossible without the kit, one of my friends who was in the trade who is a really good mechanic cacked himself the first time he did one, until i lent him the kit! lol
The car mechanics have their own magazine....tricks of the trade etc......you can do the cam belt without the "kit".........but the technology for cam belts has moved on in leaps an bounds .........an youd be a bloody fool if you didnt use one.
I was flying its safe to say :oops:
Probably about a ton, can't remember on the gear though! 4th or 5th, 4th knowing me :lol:
doh, just have to get the cyl head removed and hope mate, ive seen a few were its knocked the roller rockers off from cam to valve so less damage was caused!
Well the fact they accepted it back in my eyes says they're going to have to go the whole hog when they open it up!
So I don't care how bad it is aslong as I don't have to pay :D
tbh mate you shouldnt have to pay for sod all as its failed so soon after belts was done, be it part failure or fitting failure they should cover it!
Aye richy but its a tad of an akward story surrounding it..
I bought the car through a bloke called Mike who sells mainly vans and a few cars, the car was bought from new and used as a company car by Mike's missus' best mate (are you with me so far?!?!)
Anyway it broke down on her due to faulty aux belt due to age (her fault for not keeping on time) - she passed the car onto Mike to sell for her as she was in fiancial bother and needed the cash, she told Mike to keep out of it what she owes her for labour/parts/selling it to me and give her the rest.
He knew jack shit about the car hence the reason I went over looking at an immaculate 33k car in perfect condition (all important recent belt changes :lol:) and drove away with it for £3,600 with a fresh 6 months tax disc :wink:
So the work was actually done for Mike, hence the reason I had to ring mike to get him to contact the garage - at the end of the day it could have happened while he was test driving it and he'd have been straight back to compalin!
So if he says is true and they are very good and have a good reputation they should do it for nowt.
yup, just about followed that lol
hopefully all will be ok then!
The car mechanics have their own magazine....tricks of the trade etc......you can do the cam belt without the "kit".........but the technology for cam belts has moved on in leaps an bounds .........an youd be a bloody fool if you didnt use one.
Id love to see how, with no timing marks on the pulleys and a spinning bottom pulley,
^^^^ ever seen Wheel of fortune? :wink:
The car mechanics have their own magazine....tricks of the trade etc......you can do the cam belt without the "kit".........but the technology for cam belts has moved on in leaps an bounds .........an youd be a bloody fool if you didnt use one.
Id love to see how, with no timing marks on the pulleys and a spinning bottom pulley,
must be able to set them up with a dial gauge if the settings are available..
all engines can be set up very accurately with a dial gauge and angle gauge.. or lift at tdc..
does the 172 like the f7p have the plug in the side of the block where you
push a special tool or(screwdriver} into the web of the crank to get tdc ?
yeah it does col, same place as on f7 engines
sideways danny
24-03-2009, 03:19
The car mechanics have their own magazine....tricks of the trade etc......you can do the cam belt without the "kit".........but the technology for cam belts has moved on in leaps an bounds .........an youd be a bloody fool if you didnt use one.
Id love to see how, with no timing marks on the pulleys and a spinning bottom pulley,
must be able to set them up with a dial gauge if the settings are available..
all engines can be set up very accurately with a dial gauge and angle gauge.. or lift at tdc..
the rocker cover IS the cam bearings though, so you can't take the cover off to clock the cams up. It's a simple enough procedure once you've done a few, but I also crapped myself the first few times. got 4 to do next week now
^^^^^^^^^^^^
shit design then...how do you set up performance cams on these engines then..or do they also run on standard pulleys and timing marks..
If you have the head off anyway, timing is easy.
That was a trek!
Right its back where it started - lets hope they don't take forever to fix the cunt.
sideways danny
25-03-2009, 00:03
^^^^^^^^^^^^
s**t design then...how do you set up performance cams on these engines then..or do they also run on standard pulleys and timing marks..
locking tools give you bang on book setup if you use them right. works well. Adjustable pulleys available if you get non-vvt cams, but the setup is either trial and error, or fabrication of something so you dont need the rocker cover (ballache)
^^^^^^^^^^^
cheers..yeah sounds a ball ache...could you not machined lumps from a cam cover to gain access or are they are paired like the F7 cam carries..
**** me f4r gets more and more fail everytime i hear bout them, what a shite engine :wink:
sideways danny
25-03-2009, 02:44
^^^^^^^^^^^
cheers..yeah sounds a ball ache...could you not machined lumps from a cam cover to gain access or are they are paired like the F7R cam carries..
cover is matched to the head. It's not been an issue so far, they make good power using standard positions, but i'll probably cut something up soon, if i get hold of a mashed head
sideways danny
25-03-2009, 02:45
f**k me f4r gets more and more fail everytime i hear bout them, what a shite engine :wink:
they're all french :wink:
you might get daz,s.............. :(
Piston 4 smashed itself to bits and took the entire block with it...
Thinking of biting the bullet and going for a full rebuild rather than engine swap - not sure yet.
If they're not prepared to accept the costs I'll be damned if I'm letting them fix it and taking my hard earned.
Problem at the moment is the fact I'm starting to need it again now, and getting it to somewhere to do the rebuild, engine swap, might need to borrow that trailer yet 'rop!
Find out tomorrow if we have an engine, 29,800 miles out of a rear ended 172 95% we've got it according to the garage.
So hopefully I'll be back on the road soon with it not costing me anything or very very little.
Can't tell you how stressed i've been trying to sort this out! hopefully this engine will be as quick as the last one without it trying to kill its internals!
16v_paddy
31-03-2009, 18:50
Find out tomorrow if we have an engine, 29,800 miles out of a rear ended 172 95% we've got it according to the garage.
So hopefully I'll be back on the road soon with it not costing me anything or very very little.
Can't tell you how stressed i've been trying to sort this out! hopefully this engine will be as quick as the last one without it trying to kill its internals!
I'm pretty sure most of us can understand though :roll:
Its not been for me really its been for the missus, I've had to pinch her car while mines being sorted leaving her struggling - its the most practical solution but it still feels shit.
katbloke
31-03-2009, 20:21
need a sports cat for the new willy when you get it?
;)
j/k
Well slowly updating this now...
Still not got it back, after everyone arguing with each other no-one prepared to pay for it me and the previous owner ****ed them all off and decided to pay for it ourselves - very good of her to be honest!
Mega pissed off as an order had already been put in for a low mileage engine and was paid for - happy about that but not happy about the price they paid! :shock:
So I now have to pay for half and engine, half a set of engine mounts, half labour.
Close to four figures I reckon.
Went down the legal route and was advised that I can't really do much about it.
Car has now gone from a bargain to normal price for one of these at the mileage so its meh but could have been worse. I just want it back! been nearly a month now since I blew up.
What do I do regarding engine numbers now then, or should I just play ignorant and leave it as it is?
no just them..then supercharge the ones that needs a piston.. :twisted:
no just them..then supercharge the ones that needs a piston.. :twisted:
Is it just me or can I not understand any of that lol :lol:
16v_paddy
08-04-2009, 20:37
I think he means rebuild & supercharge the dead engine :lol:
It has a crack in it - I think it'll be rebuilt in the scrappers!
Didn't know what to do with the engine on the v5 - does anyone ever look at engine numbers anyway!!?
16v_paddy
08-04-2009, 21:19
I would, only because I now know about it from the civic I've got
I'd send the log book off for peace of mind so all the numbers match up when it's time to sell it on, would help as further proof the engine's been replaced along with the receipt for the work
I'm not really bothered as it will be a good long while before it goes anywhere but would you say its a bad thing its on a different engine? I myself have always frowned on it but then again I was quite happy to prepare the valver for an f7r!
thing is mate the new owner would not no the engine number has been changed just that the engine number matches the one on the log book.
if you change the number it doesn't say its been changed on the log book it only states the number..
which would then match the one in the car.
if i went to buy a car and checked the numbers and they didn't match it would put me off.
Ahhh fair enough, I'll sort it out then.
It wouldnt bother me an didnt, i changed an early valver for a later one with less miles.......an smiled every time i drove it.......as long as doesnt look botched shouldnt be a prob 8)
If you want it to remain pure.....stitch up the block..an pay the money.
D-Day tomorrow :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
'Apparentely' it will be back with me all sorted tomorrow, only ooooo 4 weeks 1 day after this all happened!
Lets see eh....
f**k me f4r gets more and more fail everytime i hear bout them, what a shite engine :wink:
mines bullet proof :lol: 65k of it's life on ITB's, still using original clutch, box etc etc no issues 8) Good engines if looked after :D
Oh the old one was well looked after, till it was messed with by monkeys!
my williams was like that too... :(
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