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Yamaha_YzF-R1
15-01-2008, 11:25
I was wondering if anyone here has converted his valver to LPG, cuz the petrol these days is very expensive..

Wobba
18-01-2008, 15:14
that would mean performance drops probably, so I doubt it!

Yamaha_YzF-R1
18-01-2008, 15:37
True, but the cash per mile drops as well :)

seanofnp
18-01-2008, 15:48
If you want good MPG, buy a diesel and join cliosport.

We here at Mk1 Land dont give a **** bout mpg ;)

Matt_16v
18-01-2008, 16:21
:goodposting:

MAXIBOY
18-01-2008, 16:34
i think you can actually make more power from lpg as it has a higher octane rating than petrol as long as you can is tuned for it......

but you do need a huge metal tank that weighs a lot...

unless you go 100% lpg you need dual tanks and an engine that will run petrol as well which means a performance drop on gas

BristolSam16v
18-01-2008, 17:28
With the newer LPG systems there is hardly any performance loss. My mate had an older style one on his 2.0 vectra and that only had a slight loss in performance. Besides went you want performance you just flick it back to petrol and your away ;)

Wobba
18-01-2008, 18:05
My mates V8 Range Rover has an LPG conversion. When it switches to LPG from petrol it is barely noticeable but he can tell a slight power drop. I guess setup for performance it could be fine, same with anything really...

Matty86
18-01-2008, 19:21
think of the weight of those LPG tanks!!

number1
18-01-2008, 19:23
Im sure someone on cliosport will be able to tell you more about this conversion :lol:

Yamaha_YzF-R1
18-01-2008, 19:56
With the newer LPG systems there is hardly any performance loss. My mate had an older style one on his 2.0 vectra and that only had a slight loss in performance. Besides went you want performance you just flick it back to petrol and your away ;)
My point exactly! :) The thing is that I am a student and do not have a job so the funds are a bit tight, but I really want a clio 16v, that's why I am thinking of lpg. However on this engine the convertion is done with a LPG injection system which means that the lpg does not use the petrol jets and there fore the car will stay in good condition on petrol so whenever I want I could switch it. I have been told that with the LPG injection system the car's performance i 99% the same and it even runs the same MPG like the petrol but in half the price for a gallon.

BRUN
18-01-2008, 20:33
i could do with better mpg, dont usually get over 30

stan
18-01-2008, 20:49
LPG wont give you anymore than 30mpg, it gives less than petrol.

It has better knock resistence than pump petrol, so higher comp ratios can be used (though mechanical disadvantages come into play when you go too high), or higher boost levels if running pressure charging. it has a calorific value of 20-25% less than petrol, so in theory you will loose power on a like for like std engine. I.e. to gain "lost" power you need to cram in more fuel, that means better flowing heads, more boost, etc
IMO it would be a good fuel for a turbo charged engine...

If you want a cheap LPG set-up...look on ebay for the components. You can buy a sequential, programable system for £330!! you'd need a tank and fittings also, but its still way cheap!!

Yamaha_YzF-R1
18-01-2008, 21:53
Here in Bulgaria used LPG ignition systems can be bought for about 200 pounds, and new ones for about 300 with everything incooded. About the turbo engine I know that there are turbo LPG evaporators so it's not imposible :)

Yamaha_YzF-R1
18-01-2008, 21:56
The only real disadvantage of the LPG for me is that adds about 50-60 kilos to the car's weight.. everything else I can live with.. looks like I'll have to do some stripping to counter-measure that :P

Rob72
18-01-2008, 22:10
i done 200,000 miles in a transit van with lpg.
had nothing but hassle...always switchin from gas to petrol

ended up the top end got too hot and melted the valves .

tech guys at ford dont hav a clue how to fix probs either.

sayin that the vauxhall astras were ok with the gas....

good idea if u want cheap fuel but reliability can be problematic..

no difference in performance imo..

Yamaha_YzF-R1
19-01-2008, 09:58
i done 200,000 miles in a transit van with lpg.
had nothing but hassle...always switchin from gas to petrol

ended up the top end got too hot and melted the valves .

tech guys at ford dont hav a clue how to fix probs either.

sayin that the vauxs**t astras were ok with the gas....

good idea if u want cheap fuel but reliability can be problematic..

no difference in performance imo..
Now I am driving a clio 1.2 on lpg and for about 5-6 year running ONLY on gas(I start the car on petrol ONLY in very cold weather, otherwise starting on LPG) and haven't got any problems with reliability...

stan
19-01-2008, 11:26
You can run a turbo engine on gas easily, so long as the feed pressure is around 1bar above the manifold boost pressure.

i had a Combo on LPG, was great 99% of the time, but it did give a wee bit of hassle. I found usually it was when the vapouriser wasnt heating properly i.e coolant was low!

Lunner
19-01-2008, 11:39
With the newer LPG systems there is hardly any performance loss. My mate had an older style one on his 2.0 vectra and that only had a slight loss in performance. Besides went you want performance you just flick it back to petrol and your away ;)
My point exactly! :) The thing is that I am a student and do not have a job so the funds are a bit tight, but I really want a clio 16v, that's why I am thinking of lpg. However on this engine the convertion is done with a LPG injection system which means that the lpg does not use the petrol jets and there fore the car will stay in good condition on petrol so whenever I want I could switch it. I have been told that with the LPG injection system the car's performance i 99% the same and it even runs the same MPG like the petrol but in half the price for a gallon.

Get a job then, i'm in my final year of uni, doing a full time uni course and working a 30 hour week, always worked even through 1st and 2nd year of uni, wtf is the point of converting to LPG over the time you'll use it at uni will you actually be saving?

When iw as driving my hybrid each day i was getting best part of 40mpg, simply cus i was driving sensibly and not with a heavy right foot, or **** teh idea of a 16v off till you can afford it and geta cheap run around

drsmith1979
19-01-2008, 13:31
now now children, play nice 8)

Yamaha_YzF-R1
19-01-2008, 14:05
sorry I asked....

Lunner
19-01-2008, 14:20
Not being a cunt lol, just passing on advice, how do you think i manage to own a highly modded hybrid thats had thousands spent on it while i'm still a full time student, and a newish diesel vectra run around

Yamaha_YzF-R1
19-01-2008, 18:01
I understand but here the things are a bit more complicating... if there was any chance of me working believe me I would have already started..

G33R7
19-01-2008, 19:17
here in the netherlands the malboro cup clio used a lpg installation. sadly no pics of that.

BristolSam16v
19-01-2008, 20:35
I don't believe you got nearly 40mpg out of a 2.0 :o if you did then shame on you, thats not how they're meant to be driven :P

davem
19-01-2008, 20:45
I used to fit lpg conversions and found that on average there was about a 20% power loss. Also you would lose about 10% on your mpg, however due to the price being less than half that of petrol it worked out that you would get twice as many miles per pounds worth of fuel.

The lower mpg is due to, as stan said, the lower calorific value of the gas so you have to put more fuel in to get the same result. Gas does have a higher knock resistance but burns slightly hotter than petrol and does not lubricate the valve seats etc as well, therefore premature valve wear is common and melted spark plugs in bad cases. Also due to the nature of the gas temperature changes can affect it a lot more so is less stable and the metering isnt as accurate causing fuel problems usually followed by pinking and dead engines!

I would say by all means convert a clio 16v to gas, however bear in mind the extra weight, servicing costs, cost of the kit and weigh up over the mileage that you will actually do whether or not it is going to save you much. I bet it isnt! Also if you own a valver the point is to go quick, something that isnt going to work as well on gas.

And to finish! If you wanna own a valver but cant afford to put petrol in it then you aint gonna afford to run one properly so buy something cheaper to run until you can afford to run one or the valver will end up unused and broken until you can afford to fix it! surely a better option is a car you can afford to run all the time and not just some of the time.

wavy
19-01-2008, 20:51
my mpg has dropped through the floor lately
mainly because of the price rise and my new job is only 2 or 3 mins from my door and with a 5am start i make full use of the empty road lol :lol:
there are a few gas garage places near me and i have thought about doing it if i had a different car or a valver :lol:











only kidding guys :-) but i would definatly do it if i didnt wanna keep mine as is 50p a litre is back to the 80's lol

BristolSam16v
19-01-2008, 21:50
LPG is slowly but surely creeping up in price as well, soon won't be much of a saving at all.

Yamaha_YzF-R1
20-01-2008, 08:44
LPG is slowly but surely creeping up in price as well, soon won't be much of a saving at all.
Ues it is but the petrol price is creeping as well.

BRUN
20-01-2008, 10:02
40mpg Lunner ! are you sure, ive never seen over 35

superfive
21-01-2008, 17:23
Hello,


I did, actually a guy who sold me my valver did it a week before I bought it.

I'll post some pics tommorow.


Here it's around half price (LPG/Gas). I'm from Serbia and Montenegro.

Yamaha_YzF-R1
21-01-2008, 17:42
Oh serbia - you're my neighbour :P

white16valver
21-01-2008, 18:33
ooh, this board is very international! :D




I don't believe you got nearly 40mpg out of a 2.0 :o if you did then shame on you, thats not how they're meant to be driven :P
knowsit! :P

superfive
26-01-2008, 16:20
Complete story ...


This is the simplest way to put LPG in your valver, it's not "sequent" type with additional injectors for LPG, this type mix LPG and air after the air filter in very simple (primitive) way:

http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/103/lpg1tr5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


You need this part if you want to drive it (almost) perfectly:

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/9903/lpg2iw7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


Unfortunately there is no part like this specially made for Clio 1.8 on market, because noone installs this type of LPG in cars like this. So I had to use this part for Audi 80 1.8 and a lot of silicone ...


http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/1074/lpg4vq3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


As you can see, there is some gap, so I supposed that performances are bit lowered.

After all, I'm really glad with this LPG conversion.

I don't have almost any space in my trunk, just for subwoofer :), but I've made 30000 km in 6 months and it works fine, just sometimes during parking my car, when I switch from first gear to reverse at the moment when I press clutch, it turns off.

Here 1L of gasoline is 1 euro, and 1L of LPG is 0.6 and consumption is almost the same.

If you want to try to do conversion ... good luck!!!

Lunner
26-01-2008, 17:05
40mpg Lunner ! are you sure, ive never seen over 35

ROUGH working out, £40 to fill up, 400 mile to a tank than thats ROUGHLY 50 mpg, i used to get about 350ish to £40, thats when juice was about £1/ltr

Just worked it out and that works out to 39mpg given that there are 4.5 ltrs/gallon

Matty86
26-01-2008, 17:31
I get those miles too, especially on the motorway...


Lunner, have to ask how many contact hours you have at uni?

most of my days were 9-5, with a fair amount of 'self study' time ontop - and add sport and clios ontop ;)


tricky to commit to more than a couple of hours a week for a job

superfive
26-01-2008, 17:40
My average consumption is 10-11 liters/100km LPG in urban driving. On open road it's lower.

Lunner
26-01-2008, 18:09
I get those miles too, especially on the motorway...


Lunner, have to ask how many contact hours you have at uni?

most of my days were 9-5, with a fair amount of 'self study' time ontop - and add sport and clios ontop ;)


tricky to commit to more than a couple of hours a week for a job

I'm in my final year, course is structured so i have 2 full days in uni, 9-6, i then work the remaining 3 days on site, doing 10 hours a day, uni work gets done at the weekend, and in my frees whilst i'm at uni, weekend also gets used for getting pissed off and as and when i can find time, rebuilding my clio......don't leave me alot of time for it tho

Lunner
26-01-2008, 18:10
I get those miles too, especially on the motorway...


Lunner, have to ask how many contact hours you have at uni?

most of my days were 9-5, with a fair amount of 'self study' time ontop - and add sport and clios ontop ;)


tricky to commit to more than a couple of hours a week for a job

I'm in my final year, course is structured so i have 2 full days in uni, 9-6, i then work the remaining 3 days on site, doing 10 hours a day, uni work gets done at the weekend, and in my frees whilst i'm at uni, weekend also gets used for getting pissed up and as and when i can find time, rebuilding my clio......don't leave me alot of time for it tho

davem
26-01-2008, 20:08
damn bloody students!!

without offending anyone too much, if you choose to become a student and commit a lot of your time to study then dont moan about not being able to afford petrol or a car. As for working if you didnt spend so much time in the student bar then you might find time to earn some money!

Anyways i'm sure once you have finished your course you will be earning silly amounts of money and able to afford the car and the petrol to go in it whilst paying people like me to fix them! So its all down to patience. Be patient and you will have what you want in the end. In the mean time dont try and find ways of affording things you cant afford because it will only cause more problems.

No offence to students im sure you will all work hard one day!

Lunner
26-01-2008, 20:14
I'm a student, and earning more money at the moment than some of my mates working full time, but then i'm being paid alot of money, and as of the summer when i finish i'll be being paid a stupid amount of money.

Manage to build the clio up, get pissed all the time and run a newish vectra and still have money left over......but the first few years worked at the weekends and was skint, still managed to tune the clio and go out on the piss though.

Student loan is being saved this year and is paying for a holiday to ibiza in the summer

davem
26-01-2008, 20:30
I aint slagging students off, if you work as well as study then well done to ya.

I just dont like students who moan about being skint and having no money when it was their choice to become a student in the first place.

I chose the other route, did an apprenticeship, worked fecking hard, and then got my own business, some weeks i can earn silly money, and when i started the business i had mates who i went to school with who had just finished uni coming and paying me stupid money to fix their cars. It was satisfying to know that they had put up with years of being skint and stressed and they were no better off.