View Full Version : Clio Williams 1 won't start
Hi I was wondering if anyone can help with this issue I have with a recently purchased L reg Clio Williams 1.
I was driving along at about 60mph down a dual carriageway and I suddenly lost all power. There was no smoke or anything like that....tried to bump start whilst slowing down but there was no response.
Now when I try to start, it turns but does not fire up.
Theres no spark producing from the ignition box.
AA reckon faulty ignition box else faulty ECU.
Seems to have coincided with a recent (4 days previous) decat pipe installation.
Wondering whether this is immobiliser connected as it is behaving like an immobiliser has kicked in? Does the Williams come with a standard immobiliser? It may have had one installed in its time as there is like a switch at the bottom of the gearstick under the hand brake. The guy that sold me the car never mentioned alarm or immobiliser and was using the key to manually open the doors. Bought a battery for the keyfob and started using it simply to open and close the Central Locking but this was about a month ago.
Tried removing battery several times once for atleast 2 hours - no luck.
Just removed the ECU and gonna leave it for an hour or 2 to see what happens.
Anyone have any ideas??? Please help.....the missus is none too please!!!!
bass_direct
01-01-2007, 19:18
williams didn't have immobiliser..
could be faulty ecu.. but doubt it..
check the earths
Try swapping the coil pack, i ahve one in the garage you can have for a tenner
Failing that chack the coil (ignition box) is getting power
MatBrown
01-01-2007, 21:29
Cambelt's not snapped is it?
Mat.
Thanks for all the advice....this is a great forum!
Earths are fine.
The Cam Belt is not snapped.
Not sure what a coil pack is but the ignition box itself is not giving out power. Unsure if it's receiving power.
I'm no expert but my suspicions are with the ECU and the recent decat pipe installation. The car was running slightly dog rough after the work had been done. Could the ECU be 'confused' by the change at all? Is it at all possible that it may need re-programming? Or have I just made a complete prat of myself by asking that lol!?!
It's a damn shame cos I've always wanted one of these Bad Boys since it was released. I truly hope this incident does not put me off the model! I'm hanging in there....
de-cat won't effect it lamba is upsteam of the de-cat, engine doesn't know that it has one fitted
bass_direct
01-01-2007, 22:35
where are you based mate? i'm sure somebody would come down and have a look
Andyvalver
01-01-2007, 22:36
Earth. Remove them all, get some sand paper and clean up the terminals and re fit. Doubt it is the ecu, they dont usually break.
Dancliovalver
01-01-2007, 22:38
mine did exactly the same thing, had the AA out to it and it was the coil pack had packed up!!!!
had exactly the same symptoms as urs mate :lol:
Andyvalver
01-01-2007, 22:41
Coil is about £30 from gsf. When i had these syptoms ended up buyin a coil/ dizzy+ rota arm/ leads ect... and it was earths :lol:
I'm from Milton Keynes - If you guys could recommend any reliable mechanics to look into this.
I will double check the earths tomorrow and failing that, I will change the coil pack.
MANY THANKS for the advice - I will keep you all updated.
I'm from Milton Keynes - If you guys could recommend any reliable mechanics to look into this.
I will double check the earths tomorrow and failing that, I will change the coil pack.
MANY THANKS for the advice - I will keep you all updated.
As above, Flan is in MK, and does work for a price
Might be fuel feed related, if it's cranking but not firing up. Can you hear the fuel pump whir when you are about start up?
Just re-read the bit about no sparking - it's probably not fuel feed related then. Check the fuses/relays and earthing. Had the same problem some time ago (and also suspected ECU), it was traced to a bad earth connection on one of the relays.
My first thought would be cambelt but you seem sure the cambelt is fine?
When you take the dizzy cap off can you see the rotor spinning (when you crank her over)? It's only 2 screws so easy to rule out. the rotor sits inside the cap and sits on the end of the exhaust camshaft.
So long as it isn't cambelt, then it should be quite easy to sort out :wink:
Just so you are all aware.....
I can't find the time at the mo to have a look but Flan has kindly agreed to come to MK to see if he can help.
Hopefully the next time I update will be to close this post with the resolution!!!
MattyH16valver
03-01-2007, 22:19
Flans a good lad...helped me with my car b4 8)
TDC sensor?
Test for continuity across it.
TDC sensor?
Test for continuity across it.
you mean the cps on the box, :? i know they sometimes fail
will try and get over on saturday, can't do much in the dark :lol: have you ordered a new coilpack or any bits.
Flan
have you ordered a new coilpack or any bits.
Flan
Thanks Flan!
I have a new coil pack on reserve locally....nothing else.
yes, crank position/top-dead centre sensor
yes, crank position/top-dead centre sensor
thought so. Stan your just to technical sometimes :lol:
i might have a spare one knocking about somewhere ill have to have a look...
ps i hate electrics :P
My ex-mechanic friend has been looking into this and this is the story so far....
- Cambelt has not snapped.
- The rotor under the dizzy cap does spin when cranked.
- Taking the battery off for over 2 hours and putting back on has not helped.
- Reinstalling ECU has not helped after over a day of it sitting by the radiator.
- Confident its not bad earths as he believes that there would be atleast some attempt to spark but there is no spark at all.
- TDC/CPS is fine.
- Coil pack replaced - same problem.
- Live signal is getting to the coil and out of the HT lead.
The suspected immobiliser switch is completely disconnected however there was an uncovered loom which still needs to be investigated.
However the main suspicion at present lies with the ECU.
To understand the ECU better can anyone answer the following:
1. If the ECU was faulty, would a live current be able to get to the coil?
2. Believe that water getting into the ECU is a common issue, is corrosion the only sign for this situation? In other words should we rule this out if there is no corrosion.
3. Will diagnostics services establish an ECU fault - ie getting someone to plug a laptop in?
Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Also, if anyone has a working ECU for the Williams 1 they would like to sell, please PM me details so I have all options open!
........actually forget that!
ECU was checked by Autocraft in Luton (only £30!) and results were fine.
Tried earthing the ignition lock relay to the battery terminal (advice courtesy of Purple) - no luck however this time when turning there was a rapid quiet clicking sound (not the starter motor).
Next up on the drawing board........the crank sensor.
Also replaced the ignition lock relay (403) - no luck :cry:
what alarm is fitted to the car ?
when u turn it over are you getting fuel from the pump ???
Does its sound as if its trying to start or does it turn over slowly ????
no luck however this time when turning there was a rapid quiet clicking sound (not the starter motor).
If it's rapid clicking, I think gunnergibson had that too. Go search for his posts round about Sep '05 to Mar '06. Renault electrics - heartbreaking, ain't it? But when it's all working, you wonder what all the fuss was about.
Might seem daft but have you checked the fuses in the engine bay?
Mine wouldn't start today and it was due to a blown fuse..
couple of posts above, in the long list from ur ex mechanic mate, it says that you ARE getting spark out the HT leads, is this right? if so the coil was dead and you have sorted ignition problem by swapping it? if this is the case then:
now time to move on, fuel would be next on my list, is the fuel pump kerfuffled? test by cranking engine again, then remove fuel line from fuel rail carefully and see if its pressurising fuel system. if not then your fuel pump/wiring to pump/fuel pump relay could be knacked
Just to clarify: There is no spark. The engine cranks when the key is turned but does not start.
There is however a live electrical current passing through the HT lead from the coil pack.
The cranking sound sounds consistent....no spluttering....does not get higher or lower in tone/pitch....only as the battery starts to die.
Fuses have been checked.
There is no alarm/immobiliser currently fitted but may have had a previous immobiliser/alarm fitted in the past that was not fully disabled/removed so we have not ruled this possibility out.
Today (if Renault has it in) the crank sensor is being replaced with a new one as this was not really properly checked before.
To Purple: Yes....heartbreaking it is BUT I still love the little thing! :D
VIPERONE
11-01-2007, 21:14
Sand down the earth on the gearbox, and check the rest are fixed on.
ie loom to box earth etc
VIPERONE
11-01-2007, 21:15
in fact cancel that advice lol
VIPERONE
11-01-2007, 21:21
check all fuses , double check the gearbox earth, did you just replace the coil...as there is: part no. 77 00 852 662 MODULE IGN
ignition module.. they can fail.
the fault will be something silly, and at most a split in the loom etc.
Just to clarify: There is no spark. The engine cranks when the key is turned but does not start.
There is however a live electrical current passing through the HT lead from the coil pack.
The cranking sound sounds consistent....no spluttering....does not get higher or lower in tone/pitch....only as the battery starts to die.
Fuses have been checked.
There is no alarm/immobiliser currently fitted but may have had a previous immobiliser/alarm fitted in the past that was not fully disabled/removed so we have not ruled this possibility out.
Today (if Renault has it in) the crank sensor is being replaced with a new one as this was not really properly checked before.
To Purple: Yes....heartbreaking it is BUT I still love the little thing! :D
if there is a current in it then like gibbo says, likely to be earth, random loom split of knacked ignition coil
I've not been in the country past few weeks due to work but the car was eventually taken in for repair. Apparently the electrics were badly wired from previous owner(s) but the reason for no spark was that half the loom was burnt out, old and brittle. Cost £170 for diagnosis and fix...apparently friend prices....was in for a few days.
Now I can't wait to come back to the UK and give her a go!
Thanks for all your help and advice.
VIPERONE
20-02-2007, 13:05
your welcome... thought'd be a loom fault..
williams didn't have immobiliser..
could be faulty ecu.. but doubt it..
check the earths
according to my paper work my car got fitted with an immobiliser they day after it was registered by the garage
i thought all the 1's would be the same ?
my insurance insists u have to have atleast that to get insured :?
btw great to hear u have got the problem sorted out now :thumbsup:
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