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NickFr
29-04-2005, 08:10
Just out of interest, what will you Car lovers vote for?

Mark_Ritchspeed
29-04-2005, 09:04
Tory for me. Although I would probably vote for just about anyone who has a chance of getting the current wankers out of government. Liberals excluded.

VIPERONE
29-04-2005, 09:12
Tory....

J o n
29-04-2005, 09:36
who saw Blair getting ripped to shreds last night? PMSL - what a cock snogger

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 10:15
You knw, this might sound odd, but the best party for policies, including attitudes to car use is actually the green party.

Unfortunately we don't have one in our area so Tory it is. Anything to get that cunt-faced liar out.

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 10:41
Everyone i ask says they want Blair out. I wonder if the polls have got it wildly wrong?

The polls put him ahead. If thats the case. Where the hell are all these labour voters?

Dilusi
29-04-2005, 10:44
I'll be voting Labour, the Tories did enough damage last time round.

Dilusi
29-04-2005, 10:47
I'll be voting Labour, the Tories did enough damage last time round.

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 10:56
If you speak to your elders you'll find that Labour did a fvck load of damage iast time they were in though. The tories fixed a lot of it.

Mark_Ritchspeed
29-04-2005, 11:04
They will all **** us over. Its just the ones that **** us over the least that I want in. Says a lot about politics in this country really. :x

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 11:05
People claim the tories damaged the economy. However, as an armchair economics expert (yes i am sad enough to study economics), it is actually a false assumption based on spin from labour. Firstly, the economy was not in a bad shape under the thatcher tories. It is a misconception. Its funny that most of the poople who claim the tories ruined the economy are not actually old enough to remember the economy they inherited from Labour. How about power cuts every other day. Trade union strikes. 3 day working weeks. The fact is that the Labout governemtn during the 70's pretty much brough this country to its knees, and the reason Thatcher was voted in with such a majority was because people had had enough. Now predjudice aside, whether you like the woman or not, she was undoubtably one of the finest prime ministers this country has every had. The economy the tories created in the 80's and early 90's is the same economy that the Labour govenment is claiming to have created. Rubbish.

The delay between taking power and being able to effect the economy is about 5 to 10 years. So a government need that amout of time to either positively or negatively effect the economy.

So when the tories took control of the country in the 80's it would not be until the 90's that the stability in the economy became apparent. Which is exactly what happened. The mid 90's and the economy was stable and properous. The again now Labour have taken control it will not be for the same amount of time until they see a negative shift to the economy. So from about 2005 we should see what Labout is REALLY doing to our economy. Up to now they have been riding the tory wave. Its from about 2005 that their changes will occur. And it just so happens that Labour is starting to borrow too much because there is a down turn in the economy and projections predicted by the chancellor are too wild.


I guarantee that this country will fall apart under labour in the next 5 years. The people will then be so hateful that everyone will vote tory no matter who is in charge. The tories will them stay in power through the next few terms untill the people forget how bad labour are and start to beleive their bullshit.

I sound like i am a tory voter but i m not. But i know that what this governemnt claims is happening to the economy to the public is far from the truth. You have been warned.

Dilusi
29-04-2005, 11:07
All the Tories did when they were in was make a few rich people even richer and everyone else poorer. Yeah Labour make mistakes but do you really think the Tories will be any better?

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 11:33
That's balls mate.

What KS says is spot on. The borrowing that labour have allowed to go on will come back in the next few years to well and truly fvck everyone. We are effecticvely living on a false economy at the moment. Plus taxes will go up under Labour, in order to fund their tactic of just throwing money at problems in the hope they'll go away.

Speaking to my elders they're all saying that what Labour are doing now is exactly what they've always done and it will be the Tories that come in and straighten everything out again.

Rich
29-04-2005, 11:35
well tbh i think it's about time people stopped narrowing their options to either just tory or labour tbh! obviously being a student i would love to see the lib dems voted in to abolish fees as although i am lucky and my parents pay my tuition fees i think it's harsh that someone who wishes to better their education should have to pay to do so! i mean if everyone thought **** it i'm not gonna bother we would eventually run out of teachers, doctors etc that enable education and health what all governments are keen to promote in young and old!
i'm taking a risk and voting lib dem tbh and i hope many more vote other than tory or labour cos i'm only young (19) and sick of both parties bullshit already!

Dilusi
29-04-2005, 11:41
You can hardly blame the government for the amout of money that people are borrowing. Thats just down to individuals wanting things they can't afford.

Everyones circumstances are different and the two parties will have advantages and disadvantages depending on these. For me, I feel that my family as a whole were a lot worse off under Tory rule.

NickFr
29-04-2005, 11:54
Well, being one of the older members, I would confirm all that KS has stated, however what really pissed me off is that Tony Blair, who incidentally started life as a Tory, got voted in having launched a bitter assault on the SLEAZE of the Tory party, some of which was true I grant you.

However, since this attack he has presided over one of the most corrupt, sleazy, and lying goverments ever to grace politics. As for the accusation that the tories are a goverment for the rich, this is exposed as a Myth, given that there are more Millionaires in the Labour party than Tories.

Charles Kennedy is not a personality, but prehaps he would govern by consensus, unlike PRESIDENT all teeth and trousers Blair, who I suspect will be remembered more for SPIN and sound bites and an abject inability to listen to his advisors, cabinet or the people that elected him.

RANT over, would probably vote Tory at the moment, Labour relies on the apathy of families who have always voted labour and would not recognise a manifesto if it went down on them :shock:

J o n
29-04-2005, 12:36
yup, KS is pretty much spot on there... as for voting for lib dems to abolish student fees, who do you think will pay them then? Even Tony had a valid point, tax payers pay something like 5/6 of student fees, yet they moan about having to put something back into the economy... bollox, get jobs and pay it yerselves then I can have more disposable income... that's fairer IMO.

NickFr
29-04-2005, 13:07
My suggestion has always been, fine the country will educate you for FREE including getting a degree, BUT you must sign a legal declaration that you will stay in the UK for 10-20yrs?, so as to benefit the very people whose taxes paid for you! to often these students get their qualifications and **** off abroad because they chase the bigger bucks, hardly fair methinks.

Also, how many MEDIA degrees does the country need, it needs engineers, doctors, dentists not namby pamby degrees as above.

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 13:07
You can hardly blame the government for the amout of money that people are borrowing. Thats just down to individuals wanting things they can't afford.

Everyones circumstances are different and the two parties will have advantages and disadvantages depending on these. For me, I feel that my family as a whole were a lot worse off under Tory rule.

We are not talking about personal borrowing, but about the government borrowing.

The governemnt spends a certain amout each year. At the moment lets call if 500 billion. That goes on hospitals, schools roads, the army, and everything we need (services).

The money to pay from it usually comes from tax. Ie they collect taxes from us and them spend the money on the things we need.

At the moment the governement (labour) is spending more money on services than it is taking in in tax.

So lets say its spending 500 billion. But the tax we pay is only 300 billion. That means there is a 200 billion shortfall.

Now there are two places the governement can get that money.

1. Raise taxes.

2. Borrow it from banks

Both are bad for the economy, because if you tax people too much they stop spending money on other things and you get a recession. If you borrow money from banks you have to pay it back with interest.

At the moment the government needs this extra 200 billion that its spent but doesnt have. The reality is that it will have to both raise taxes AND borrow heavily from banks.

The result of this is that not only will we all be worse off because we pay more tax, we will also have less income to spend on other things and businesses will start to suffer and recession is possible. We will also have to pay back the money borrowed. It is interesting to note that it was the conservatives who managed to pay back all the money labour borrowed last time they were in power.

The basic premise comes down to 'you cant spend what you dont have'

But labour continue to promise better schools, hospitals etc, but the fact is they dont have the money.

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 14:34
Whereas the conservatives get slated for NOT throwing money at everything whilst everyone forgets their plan to cut the administrative bollocks that Labour has introduced in virtually every public sector, which is why education, health, policing, local servies are ALL on the slide. Too much time and money is spent onmeeting "targets" rather than getting the job done.

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 15:50
Only 1/4 of the population that could have voted actually voted for this Labour governement.

Only 60% of the population bothered to vote at the last election atall. Its a fact that based on the votes they have this is the most unpopular governmen ever.

That means that 75% of the voting popluation of this country either dont want Tony Blair as Prime Minister, or dont care either way.

How unpopular must he feel?

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 16:37
I wish we had 1 vote means 1 vote. As it is my vote is virtually wasted in the Labour heartland I live in.

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 17:08
I remember my father telling me about a fictional book based on Australia where different people had different votes based on who they were. It worked like this:

Everyone over the age of voting could have 1 vote in an election as normal.
However, additional votes could be earned as you achieved things in life.

For example if you earned a degree you had a second vote.

If you employed more than 5 people you earnt another vote.

If you performed an act of bravery and for example won the George cross you may receive an additional vote.

A gold medal in the olympics may be another vote.

There were many ways to achieve these additional votes, but they were all things that would help the country.

A maximum of 5 votes could be achieved, and only a select few ever achieved this.

The premise was that those people more useful to the country, could achieve more votes than those that were less useful to the country.

I think its a neat system and one that would do nothing but improve the country.

NickFr
29-04-2005, 17:50
Isn't it also law that everyone over 18 must vote :?:

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 17:57
Very possibly.

VIPERONE
29-04-2005, 18:21
plus... who the hell wants to be in the euro.. and the europeans leeching off our economic strengths

Mark_Ritchspeed
29-04-2005, 18:37
Dont get me started on f*cking Brussels. Since the new regs came in last year, importing a lot of things has become a nightmare.

In fact I should probably be voting for UKIP.

Dilusi
29-04-2005, 18:42
plus... who the hell wants to be in the euro.. and the europeans leeching off our economic strengths

According to the conservative fans amoungst you guys that wouldn't matter if Labour stay in as they are ****ing up the economy anyway :?

KingStromba
29-04-2005, 20:22
If we join Europe i am going to Australia. :D

Swervin_Mervin
29-04-2005, 20:55
Best get packing then as we're already in Europe! :wink:

Nah, I take the if you;re going to be in it it has to be full 2 feet in job. As I think we'll get fvcked for our strong economy I say fvck the whole thing off, shut the borders, raise the Jack and tell everyone to get fvcked.

BRUN
04-05-2005, 09:40
if you tax people too much they stop spending money on other things and you get a recession.

well, i work in retail, and things havent been the same since Xmas, at the moment people aint spending like they did last year, not even close