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evouk
06-11-2006, 11:00
morning all,

i am new to the forum and am looking for some advice.

after ownin variious track cars over the years i am looking for another project.

i am looking at the clio williams for my next track toy.

Can anyone advise what these are like out of the box as a track car?

What mods would be required to ensure the car lasts?

Will it need uprated calipers, pads discs, cooling systems, oil surge deterents?

Thanks

Zollo
06-11-2006, 11:10
Can anyone advise what these are like out of the box as a track car?

What mods would be required to ensure the car lasts?




Very, very good out-of-the-box. Only mod I'd say is vital is a decent set of front brake pads. Other than that, they go very quickly and work faultlessly as standard. Though that's not to say that they can't be improved :twisted:

Chris H
06-11-2006, 11:13
as above.

the power steering fluid heats up and can spit out the resovoir.

heatwise they can get toasty but oil choice and how poor the cooling system is can mean 1 willhave th efan goign all the time whilst another can do 100 laps and not get hot.

northy
06-11-2006, 11:13
decent brakes are a must as above with some cooling.

then once u get going an cage and slicks is all thats needed !

2 live
06-11-2006, 11:17
yep out the box they are a very capable car. as zollo says they can be improved, but the choices of what you do will come down to personal prefrences.



personally, id say a set of braided lines, decent pads, i have ferodo ds2500 an they work a treat.

coilovers, unless u like the sound of your mirrors scraping the tarmac under heavy cornering ;)

and just to let people know your coming, a nice de-catted, freer flowing exhaust.

after that its up to you, they respond very well to mild mods like cams, chips etc, and respond even better with throttle bodies thrown into the equation.





DO IT i think you will be impressed

Martin
06-11-2006, 14:04
For the money I think they are among the best 'normal' cars (as opposed to caterfields etc) on track, nippy enough with some simple mods and very controllable on the limit. :)

evouk
06-11-2006, 17:02
Thanks for the replies chaps.

I have owned quite a few track toys ranging from jap turbo nutte rbarges, bike powered westies and recently a nice pug 205 mi16. I did want to go down the kit car bike powered route but with a 6 month old daughter in the household now funds and space are very tight so the car will have to sit on the drive. Therefore a westy or similar is out of the question.

I am looking at another 205 or clio, never had a petrol clio and always loved the clio williams.

I would probably uprate the brakes as a precaution anyway, callipers, discs pads and fluids/lines.

Would be looking to cage it up and fit some coilovers and additional cooling fans and possibly oil cooler.

Im searching the net to find as much info as i can on tuning the clios as there all new to me!!! Any advice welcomed.

I am in staffordshire so reccomendations for garages/tuners/suppliers will be gladly accepted.

ARE ALL THE CLIO WILLIAMS 1,2,3 THE SAME ENGINE?
:D

Rich
06-11-2006, 17:04
yep, all the same engine, just williams 3's are a different colour (slightly more purpley blue), have abs and a sunroof also

Martin
06-11-2006, 17:07
Ideal buy would have been mine....but I've decided to sell bits seperatly now... :(

Will be going for a cheap price soon though...

http://www.williamsclio.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15455

northy
06-11-2006, 17:09
stay away from 3's if you want a trackday car mate - due to the sunroofs.

1's were the lightest - then 2's. The only differance between a 1 & a 2 is the two had extra door bars in for driver protection.

Matin - all yours needs is a cage and its back to where it was again !

stew
06-11-2006, 20:49
where did the cage go martin? it going in the new un? please say it is...

richy
06-11-2006, 20:55
where did the cage go martin? it going in the new un? please say it is...

nope :wink:

evouk
06-11-2006, 23:02
have you started to strip it already?

Any other tips chaps?

Andy P
06-11-2006, 23:33
have you started to strip it already?

Any other tips chaps?

Yeah get a car and keep your eye on the events section.

Actually mate, if you can stretch to it, one of the boys is selling his ex clio cup car.

Perfect :wink:

stew
06-11-2006, 23:39
:goodposting:

The list is endless of what you can do to make a williams a perfect track car, but by far the best option would be to buy arrons clio cup car. bargin for wot u get! 8)

evouk
06-11-2006, 23:43
yes have been in touch!!! :D

Daz.
06-11-2006, 23:51
yes have been in touch!!! :D

Dammit lol

northy
07-11-2006, 09:01
i think martin has only removed his cage Mr evo....dont think he is breaking it.

2 live
07-11-2006, 09:30
:goodposting:

The list is endless of what you can do to make a williams a perfect track car, but by far the best option would be to buy arrons clio cup car. bargin for wot u get! 8)



tis a very nice car that.....but i think an ex clio cup car would be better if u could dry store it between trackdays, would preserve it that little bit longer.......and seeing as tho its giong to be kept outside, id personally not get it.....and it limits you to track only driving....unless u spend £x gettin it road legal.

for the same kinda moey as an ex cup car, you could get a willy 1-2 cage it, camber it, and buckets...best of both worlds there.a car to drive to the track..on the track.and hopefully back home
lol


best way to go would be to go willy 1 or 2.no sunroof..adj camber n coilies.....can be set at the track with minimal fuss.after driving there.....imo

Zollo
07-11-2006, 09:39
Although that Cup could quite easily be converted to a road car, I'd agree with 2live - Willy 1 or 2 with coilovers and adjustable camber, running semi-slicks, would be a better bet.

Martin
07-11-2006, 10:03
Aaron's cup just needs mot...it's road ready.

stew
07-11-2006, 13:52
:imwithstupidup: :wink: :lol:

IMO its better to buy a spec'd up cup car than try and DIY. Mine has cost me ££££ so far, and still dont have wide track, and fire extingisher system. Other than that its up to cup spec, plus a few other tasty bits.

Just to prove my point....

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

**Warning this bits boring!!!!**

Car bought in Aug 05 - £1800 - 449 J plate valver, F7R engine, hillpowerchip
Seats - £500 - Cobra Imola + FIA Alloy sidemounts
Harnesses - £60 (second hand) - Willians 4 point
Cage - £300 (second hand) - OMP 10 point
Windows - £220 - Flexi Glass 4mm with sliders and moulded rear screen
Exhaust system - £700 - supersprint manifold and custom side exit
Road Wheels - £300 - white williams speedlines
Track wheels - £220 (so far) - white williams speedlines
Yoko A032r's tyres and track wheels - £200 - white turbines
Helmet - £60 - sparco
Helmet hammock - £30 - OMP
Avo coilovers - £430 - Valver track
Fibreglass bonnet - £200 - KTec skin @ 3.75kgs
Brakes - circa £200 - OMP discs, EBC kevlar pads, new lines, new bias valve, new dot 4 fluid,
Kill switch - circa £40 - FIA approved
All paint and prepping items for respraying inside and bonnet - circa £150 - white rattle cans, primer, laquer etc
Steering wheel - £130 (inc boss kit) - OMP kubic

So that little lot comes to....£5540 or there abouts. Prob more things that ive forgotten about.

Thats just parts, not including all the time ive spent doing the car, or any other service items and parts which need replaced...

such as...

altenator
front wheel bearings
fuel lines
exhaust heat sheild
radiator
both main water hoses
radiator cowl
window seals
etc etc etc

and oil, filters, plugs, leads etc etc

Although im happy with what ive done, its a great project, and something i really enjoy doing it, so the money aint a huge problem (except that im a student!!!). Its a great learning experience and one of the best ways to have fun and learn about cars at the same time. Its a good thing to put on the CV as well (being an automotive engineer!)

Next major expenses are going to be...

plumbed in fire exstingusher system
braided fuel lines
rebuilt F7R (going to rebuild one myself)
new gearbox :cry:

the arches are getting to the stage they need a little tlc, and the front bumper needs respraying.

all work in progress and plenty to keep me busy! :wink:

evouk
07-11-2006, 15:18
Thanks for the replies...

I am trying to make my mind up asap and trying to work out what it would cost to get a williams to cup car spec................

The car can be dry stored as i do have a garage but means a little persuading to the missus as shes convinced a garage is her utility room!!!!!

2 live
07-11-2006, 22:10
garages are for cars mate......therefore NOT a utility room....;)


usin a garage for a utility room would be like usin the mrs' car as a greenhouse n makin her walk evrywhere........works a treat usually ;)




get her telt

evouk
07-11-2006, 22:12
Yeah agreed..........

I may have some storage space coming soon fingers crossed!!!!

Norty whats the best email to get you on?

evocash@dsl.pipex.com here

2 live
07-11-2006, 22:23
:imwithstupidup: :wink: :lol:

IMO its better to buy a spec'd up cup car than try and DIY. Mine has cost me ££££ so far, and still dont have wide track, and fire extingisher system. Other than that its up to cup spec, plus a few other tasty bits.

Just to prove my point....

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

**Warning this bits boring!!!!**

Car bought in Aug 05 - £1800 - 449 J plate valver, F7R engine, hillpowerchip
Seats - £500 - Cobra Imola + FIA Alloy sidemounts
Harnesses - £60 (second hand) - Willians 4 point
Cage - £300 (second hand) - OMP 10 point
Windows - £220 - Flexi Glass 4mm with sliders and moulded rear screen
Exhaust system - £700 - supersprint manifold and custom side exit
Road Wheels - £300 - white williams speedlines
Track wheels - £220 (so far) - white williams speedlines
Yoko A032r's tyres and track wheels - £200 - white turbines
Helmet - £60 - sparco
Helmet hammock - £30 - OMP
Avo coilovers - £430 - Valver track
Fibreglass bonnet - £200 - KTec skin @ 3.75kgs
Brakes - circa £200 - OMP discs, EBC kevlar pads, new lines, new bias valve, new dot 4 fluid,
Kill switch - circa £40 - FIA approved
All paint and prepping items for respraying inside and bonnet - circa £150 - white rattle cans, primer, laquer etc
Steering wheel - £130 (inc boss kit) - OMP kubic

So that little lot comes to....£5540 or there abouts. Prob more things that ive forgotten about.

Thats just parts, not including all the time ive spent doing the car, or any other service items and parts which need replaced...

such as...

altenator
front wheel bearings
fuel lines
exhaust heat sheild
radiator
both main water hoses
radiator cowl
window seals
etc etc etc

and oil, filters, plugs, leads etc etc

Although im happy with what ive done, its a great project, and something i really enjoy doing it, so the money aint a huge problem (except that im a student!!!). Its a great learning experience and one of the best ways to have fun and learn about cars at the same time. Its a good thing to put on the CV as well (being an automotive engineer!)

Next major expenses are going to be...

plumbed in fire exstingusher system
braided fuel lines
rebuilt F7R (going to rebuild one myself)
new gearbox :cry:

the arches are getting to the stage they need a little tlc, and the front bumper needs respraying.

all work in progress and plenty to keep me busy! :wink:




or u could go the willy route...like i have.



williams 1 £800

return on trim...£150.....reducing amount paid for car really to 650

pair of cheap buckets off ebay....£180 with harnesses and subframes (these will be replaced at a later date mind)

set of coilies....will be here soon......£4-700...depends which susp u use

cage .......to be sourced yet, but will hopefully be one built to fit the car in question rather than an off the shelf jobby....im told £5-600.......will find out soon.


labour costs have been nothing yet.




total cost so far for a standard williams with stripped trim, ready for cage almost, and buckets and coilies fitted..... £1400

evouk
07-11-2006, 22:31
where did u find a williams for 650??

stew
07-11-2006, 22:51
yeah im not saying that it cant be done cheap. hell i could have done what ive done for a lot less, but its a learning experience for me, and i wanted everything done properly. remember it still is a road car, was used daily up till 2 months ago.

depends what you want from a track car really.

track cars dont have to look great or that....but imo best to spend what you can afford for the best components.

think wot im trying to point out is that arrons cup, or martins williams are a lot of car(s) for the money!

stew
07-11-2006, 22:52
where did u find a williams for 650??

look around. there are plenty williams going well cheap on ebay etc. just need a lot of work done, but if the engine and chassis are sound, and you are willing to spend time on other bits, and not worried about looks, then your sorted! :wink:

Andy P
07-11-2006, 23:02
or do a Zollo and use a Williams road car 8)

richy
07-11-2006, 23:39
not quite done but got all bits, just gotta finish buk


total cost so far for a standard williams with stripped trim, ready for cage almost, and buckets and coilies fitted..... £1400

as much as that!

my 1.2 track car has cost me less then £700 :wink:

not quite finished, just got to fit a few bits! but very soon! :wink:

Dancliovalver
07-11-2006, 23:48
^^^^^ think im gonna be doin this next

Oh and welcome to the club :welcome:

2 live
08-11-2006, 09:03
or do a Zollo and use a Williams road car 8)


lol...been there done that ;)




richy Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 11:39 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

not quite done but got all bits, just gotta finish buk
Quote:

total cost so far for a standard williams with stripped trim, ready for cage almost, and buckets and coilies fitted..... £1400


as much as that!

my 1.2 track car has cost me less then £700

not quite finished, just got to fit a few bits! but very soon!











aye but then i have all wide track.and 2.0 lump as std....oh....and it has a nice shiney plaque on the dash ;)




williams i bought from a garage......i was tipped off by a fellow club member........cheers andy ;)......has 2 owners from new....part history......and was a quik un wen i drove it home ;)....needs a bit of work....arches have just started on 1 side..big hole in the other....nowt a repoair panel wont fix tho...which should be done this week.



if you are prepared to put a bit into em...the cheapies can make good cars. altho having been repaired/painted i dont feel will be worth 1/2 as much as the good uns.

northy
08-11-2006, 09:05
might have found you a suitable car Mr Evo.

Zollo
08-11-2006, 09:54
or do a Zollo and use a Williams road car 8)

And they take it all in their stride 8)

Zollo
08-11-2006, 09:57
if you are prepared to put a bit into em...the cheapies can make good cars. altho having been repaired/painted i dont feel will be worth 1/2 as much as the good uns.

And that's gonna be a plus point. Having one that you don't care about and that looks a bit tatty makes track days more enjoyable, cos you don't spend the day worrying about the car.

...Or was that a sly dig. Oh wait, where's the lame-post-indicating yawning smiley....

2 live
08-11-2006, 10:12
not a sly dig at all. jus as u say..its worth fuk all.stands me at nowt really...so im not too bothered about bending it.....0159 however...has had the good fortune to not have had to see the inside of a bodyshop so far....id like to keep it that way thank u very much ;)


lol...think even stromba would struggle with the no. of attempted arguements u try to cause.......and he was banned.

Zollo
08-11-2006, 10:24
:wink:

northy
08-11-2006, 10:26
:banned:

Zollo
08-11-2006, 10:27
:o

2 live
08-11-2006, 10:51
:roll:

richy
08-11-2006, 20:00
yes you will have wide track and a 2.0 as std, and even a shiney plaque but whats that just a number lol, anyone can stick one of them on, dont mean naff all to me!!

besides mine will be cheap as ****, and if i prang it, i can go buy another 1.2 for nowt! lol and who expects a 1.2 to be even remotely quick! if you get overtaken by a vts etc on track in the williams, think of the shame :lol: :wink: :oops: :wink:

2 live
08-11-2006, 23:05
aye there is that..but i dont intend to get overtaken by any any vts's lol.



a 1.2 will be as quick as any other 2.0 if it has a 2.0 power plant......lost count of how many quick cars are badged as lesser models ........nowt new there lol. ;)

richy
08-11-2006, 23:11
that is true, so many 16v's with 2.0 engines and 1.2 badges, but mines IS a 1.2 so its not exactly a wide arched look-a-like williams with 1.2 badges, its a real 1.2 shell.

and it cost me less then £700 total inc buying the car lol :P

2 live
09-11-2006, 08:43
lol....cant argue wi that at all mate......again it depends on wot u want to use the car for, and if theres any regulations you may have to abide by for future event participation ;)

Martin
09-11-2006, 09:09
aye busted, no rs days richy...although you could probably get jeremy t to sort it!

northy
09-11-2006, 09:14
dont think that will be a problem - they had that old Reno what ever it was 25 ??? going round at cadwell.

stew
09-11-2006, 09:29
was that not a renault 9 turbo??! which could technically count as a renault "sport" version, from 300 years ago! :lol: :wink:

northy
09-11-2006, 09:45
eye - but it wasnt on there eligiable list of cars is what im saying and was accepted ontrack - so richys should be alowed on no problems.

2 live
09-11-2006, 10:12
i think it had been accepted before he turned up on track with it..im sure i saw him askin geremy on rs..

and as above...technically....they are/were the rsport versions of teh car at the time.....



but again technically...the williams and valvers shouldnt be allowed on track as they dont come under the RS badge either......;)

richy
09-11-2006, 19:32
what i want to use the car for, err trackdays lol

if its not allowed on RS days thats fine, after all it is a 1.2 lol :lol:

loads of different companys and trackdays out there so plenty of different cars other then clios/meganes to play with :wink:

evouk
10-11-2006, 09:22
Still searching for the right car to buy------

do i buy one built like a cup racer or a williams and do some modifications......

Just weighing up the costs to convert from previous email replies, seems expensive!!!

:D

2 live
10-11-2006, 09:31
what i want to use the car for, err trackdays lol

if its not allowed on RS days thats fine, after all it is a 1.2 lol :lol:

loads of different companys and trackdays out there so plenty of different cars other then clios/meganes to play with :wink:


true...but i wasnt on about trackdays ;)

a 1.2 powered by 2.0 would be useless to me tbh......even if it was faster than a std willy....would still be useless for what i want.


;)

wavy
10-11-2006, 19:50
Still searching for the right car to buy------

do i buy one built like a cup racer or a williams and do some modifications......

that cup racer that is for sale is a very good spec if u want instant track day motor

converting/upgrading will take ages and add up to loads

evouk
11-11-2006, 08:00
yes good point...........................

Think a gripper diff would suit this well. :D

Dancliovalver
11-11-2006, 10:03
i do also think that martins williams would be a good option, both very capable cars 8)

richy
11-11-2006, 15:07
what i want to use the car for, err trackdays lol

if its not allowed on RS days thats fine, after all it is a 1.2 lol :lol:

loads of different companys and trackdays out there so plenty of different cars other then clios/meganes to play with :wink:


true...but i wasnt on about trackdays ;)

a 1.2 powered by 2.0 would be useless to me tbh......even if it was faster than a std willy....would still be useless for what i want.


;)


lol well not all of like to sit and wash our cars and take them to shows :P

and as i put, my car is for trackdays nothing else!

evouk
13-11-2006, 09:17
OK

I am now trying to work out some insurance costs, the car will be int he garage most of the day and then sometimes driven to traxck days or towed.

Anyone know of any good insurers who cover limited mileage policies and even track day insurance for modified cars?

Is there a club discount scheme etc??

Cheers

Martin
13-11-2006, 09:26
Greenlight are good imo

stew
13-11-2006, 13:17
yeah greenlight are ment to be the best for that kinda stuff.

im with flux on a limited milage policy, all mods delared. just coz im still under 21. roll on 18th dec! :wink:

richy
13-11-2006, 19:41
lol....cant argue wi that at all mate......again it depends on wot u want to use the car for, and if theres any regulations you may have to abide by for future event participation ;)


so what events are these other then 3 RS days a year! gonna make it only williams allowed on track when we do a club day, you wont get anyone there lol and the 16v with a 2.0 isnt a williams, just a look-a-like so to speak!

:wink:

2 live
13-11-2006, 20:39
lol..no mate.the events have nothing to do with rs days.or club trackdays.....;)

richy
13-11-2006, 20:44
like.............................................. ...????????


FCS?
anything else?

come on come on! :wink: :P

2 live
13-11-2006, 20:56
wel see in the early ish months of next year ;)


tis all funds dependant at mo.

richy
13-11-2006, 21:02
right..... :coffee:

evouk
13-11-2006, 22:00
Any other insurers?

Will try some online ones tonight

evouk
14-11-2006, 11:57
Just starting to get some quotes on williams and clio racers etc

adrian flux, limited miles to 3k a year.

245 third party fire and theft.

covers to and from track days and private use.

MatBrown
14-11-2006, 15:58
Just starting to get some quotes on williams and clio racers etc

adrian flux, limited miles to 3k a year.

245 third party fire and theft.

covers to and from track days and private use.

How many NCB is that with?
And would you not want fully Comp?



Mat.

evouk
14-11-2006, 22:02
Yeah ideally want fully comp but it was first place i tried, still is till i get 5 mins and some more places to try.

FUll NCB

evouk
21-11-2006, 22:20
Ok ive bought the trailer, got the tow car sorted..

Just need the car now!!!

merlin
21-11-2006, 23:25
Stick with 205GTI.

David_Harrison
21-11-2006, 23:27
What car are you looking at?

evouk
22-11-2006, 16:52
Well narrowed it down to 2 a clio or a 205

evouk
22-11-2006, 17:09
Ive had an email fo this guy, further pics show that its a bit tatty and looks like its been hammered on various stages.

Spec is ok but owner has no idea of history of the car, engine he states is still 150 bhp with the so called big valve head.......

If he was closer i would go and have a look but from the picsim just not sure.

stan
22-11-2006, 18:40
its got significant damage to the rear n/s inner arch/boot area.

and no receipts for the work. prima have no record either.

evouk
22-11-2006, 21:47
Thanks, there you go then!!!!

I thought it looked dodgy